"What fiercer battles and bigger enemies do I really have?" (OVA)
You just gave a perfect answer to that question when you said, among other things:
"But, in travelling from Lagos to Benin on research trips, I have to be wary of these kidnappers.
In exploring forests in Benin, one of my research goals, I have to watch out for dangerous Fulani herdsmen described as camped in such remote locations in Edo state.
If there is an uprising against Buhari's crazy politics, or a conflagration initiated by his incendiary govt style, I might not have the stable environment to work in anymore.
So, these issues affect each of us personally. The stories of those who have suffered from these ravages make that clear.
Electricity, water and other fundamentals of life are challenging in Nigeria. I cant see any signs that this will change for most Nigerians in the next 50 years, unless by a miracle. In the midst of these deprivations, people should at least be able to live in peace."
And that was exactly what I meant, and even more so for what I had in bold. They are the battles and enemies to which I was referring to.
To answer your question when you noted, "As for 1930s/1940s British PM Neville Chamberlaine, how fair is it to describe him as a poor or bad leader?" I say, it's fair. Judging by my rudimentary knowledge of English history, his leadership was a poor one; trust me, it was. That explains why he is no household name even in British social and political history as opposed to his successor, Winston Churchill, and both were wartime, single-term leaders. But we'll let all that fly; it's not about them; it's about us.
I thank you for your commitment to the struggle. Keep fit!
Michael
On Tuesday, July 9, 2019, 3:19:55 PM GMT+1, Oluwatoyin Vincent Adepoju <toyin.adepoju@gmail.com> wrote:
Thanks Oga Afolayan.
What fiercer battles and bigger enemies do I really have?
I am not in an IDP camp like the hordes displaced in the Middle Belt by Fulani herdsmen militia.
Neither myself or anyone close to me has been kidnapped by the proliferation of right wing Fulani kidnapping cells in the SW and perhaps other parts of the country.
My library and computers, my professional tools, are intact. They have not suffered the fate of farming livelihoods destroyed by Fulani herdsmen terrorizing farmers across the nation.
But, in travelling from Lagos to Benin on research trips, I have to be wary of these kidnappers.
In exploring forests in Benin, one of my research goals, I have to watch out for dangerous Fulani herdsmen described as camped in such remote locations in Edo state.
If there is an uprising against Buhari's crazy politics, or a conflagration initiated by his incendiary govt style, I might not have the stable environment to work in anymore.
So, these issues affect each of us personally. The stories of those who have suffered from these ravages make that clear.
Electricity, water and other fundamentals of life are challenging in Nigeria. I cant see any signs that this will change for most Nigerians in the next 50 years, unless by a miracle. In the midst of these deprivations, people should at least be able to live in peace.
While Falola's observations are generally correct across time and space, they are not factual in the implications actualized by the context in which he used them.
The issue in this crisis is not the general distribution of evil and good across ethnicities and regions in Nigeria.
The issue is about the manifest efforts of the leadership of a particular ethnic group to dominate others through a combination of terrorism and manipulation of govt policy.
Is there any other ethnic leadership in Nigeria pursuing such a strategy? Is there any other ethnic militia in Nigeria of such murderous scope and territorial ambition?
No.
There has never been in Nigerian history until now.
My critique was directed at "Evil and Good are equally distributed all over the country. All ethnicities have their evil leaders" which is factually accurate in general terms but inaccurate in the way it is used in this context to suggest we dont have an intensification of evil in a particular context in Nigeria at this point in time.
I am not critiquing
'2. The victims are the poor
3. Hate speech can trigger genocide '
3. Hate speech can trigger genocide '
Although this scourge has moved from isolated regions in Benue where villagers have been displaced to more sporadic but recurrent destabilizations in the SW and SE, so it affects everyone.
I agree with the third point and I sympathize with what may be seen as Falola's predicament.
The horse of carnage is about to escape from the stable and people like Falola are desperate to hold it back. The people urging the horse on think its in their interests. When the dust of blood settles, they will be in control, they think.
Other people are insisting on confronting these destruction merchants. People like Falola are afraid that such confrontation could be grievous for the destruction peddlers.
But how do we restrain them from their folly?
Its vital to be consistent in this struggle bcs of the impressions generated by diverse kinds of response. A central aspect of the struggle is what is stated or not stated, and how things are stated, as indicated by Buhari's calculated silences as his death and intimidation merchants get busy.
I dont expect Falola to urge Northern Muslims on take an open humanistic stand on this carnage by their ethnic leadership. I dont see that as his style.
At the same time, making a public statement to an anonymous public is not the same as a characterization made on a semi-private group such as this one.
As for 1930s/1940s British PM Neville Chamberlaine, how fair is it to describe him as a poor or bad leader?
He strived heroically to prevent war in Europe by allowing some demands of Hitler's, not realizing the scope of Hitler's ambitions.
With reference to Toyin Falola's comments on this group which I was responding to, I am urging us to keep in mind the ruthless ambitions of the belligerent ethnic leadership in question while we struggle against the demonisation of the general populace associated with this leadership .
thanks
toyin
On Tue, 9 Jul 2019 at 08:46, 'Michael Afolayan' via USA Africa Dialogue Series <usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com> wrote:
--You did well, Oluwatosin Vincent Adepoju, in proffering a lengthy explanation to my brief observation. Seriously, I don't want you to shoot the proverbial fly with a million dollar cannon. You have fiercer battles and bigger enemies in the theater of operation. I sure know you were trying to react to Falola's intervention in his attempt to caution against various reactions bordering on bigotry and hate, which prompted him to state that:1. Evil and Good are equally distributed all over the country. All ethnicities have their evil leaders.
2. The victims are the poor
3. Hate speech can trigger genocide
ModeratorTake out the phrase "equally distributed" and replace it with the word "found" and you will be okay, right? I, too, will. Would it not be universally and empirically true, though, that evil and good are found all over our country (and in all societies)? Don't all ethnic groups have their leaders that are evil? Aren't the victims always the poor, prompting the saying that "when two elephants fight it's the grass that suffers"? Isn't it factual that hate speeches do have the tendency to trigger genocide?But, really, my position is not on the specificity of Falola in his three positions but the "all is well" claim that you attributed to him and that such claim would not be consistent with his known position not only in the past but even in contemporary circumstances as in the two instances I cited.And as for the Chamberlain's allusion, I think a man with such poor (or even bad) leadership record in the history of England does not fit the profile of TF that you and I know. Don't you think so?That's all I was trying to say in a nutshell.Affectionately,MOA===On Tuesday, July 9, 2019, 4:17:10 AM GMT+1, OLAYINKA AGBETUYI <yagbetuyi@hotmail.com> wrote:--Toyin Adepojus prefereed solutiin seem to be that we should arm ourselves for war and wipe out the Fulani.
Ask him where his battalions are stationed since he would not be using the Nigerian Armed Forces commanded by a Fulani President.
OAA
Sent from my Samsung Galaxy smartphone.
-------- Original message --------From: 'Michael Afolayan' via USA Africa Dialogue Series <usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com>Date: 08/07/2019 04:10 (GMT+00:00)To: usaafricadialogue <usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com>Subject: Re: USA Africa Dialogue Series - No hate speech!
This message is eligible for Automatic Cleanup! (usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com) Add cleanup rule | More info
"Efforts like yours to claim, in spite of all evidence to the contrary, that all is well, will not dissuade the right wing Fulani warlords, as the rivers of blood they are spilling makes clear, as they persistently struggle to manipulate govt policy in tandem with the massacres they are committing, trying to force Nigerians to bend to their dominance in order to gain respite from this incessant bloodletting." (Oluwatoyin Vincent Adepoju)
Dear Toyin Adepoju:
I think you are pushing this issue too far and in the process you seem to be seeing things that are not as if they are and those that are as if they are not. One of such is the claim that Falola is claiming that "all is well." I am a living witness to the fact that we just finished a conference (TOFAC) here in Nigeria (at Babcock U) plus another major gathering at the First Technical University, Ibadan, where Falola gave the first keynote address of the new institution. If anything, he said exactly the opposite of what you just said about him. I think much of what he uttered was that all was not well, and proffering solutions on the way forward. Even press reports indicated his firm stance on the need for the nation's leadership to address the problem with the "Fulani warlords" (I'm not sure he used that phrase though). Suggesting he is promoting the "all is well" propaganda tends to align him with the disillusioned folks who, like the proverbial ostrich, hide their heads in the sand. I think he is too apolitical to be in that group and is as concerned about this matter as you are, if not more. To subtly align his effort with that of Neville Chamberlain (I can't even believe you said that!!!) is such an unfair characterization for which you need to apologize to him (not that he would care whether you do or not). It's just my own "egbonly" advice to you since I like you personally.
And by the way, we missed you at TOFAC with your most interesting topic!
Stay well . . .
Michael O. Afolayan
===
--On Sunday, July 7, 2019, 6:36:57 PM GMT+1, Oluwatoyin Vincent Adepoju <toyin.adepoju@gmail.com> wrote:
Thanks, Prof.Falola,
But with all due respect are you not avoiding reality?
Your No.1 is not true - " 1. Evil and Good are equally distributed all over the country. All ethnicities have their evil leaders."
There us no other ethnicity in the country engaged in nation wide terrorism apart from right wing Fulani.
Even Boko Haram dont have that national spread.
There is no ethnic leadership in today's Nigeria supporting terrorism apart from right wing Fulani ethnic leadership, particularly Miyetti Allah Fulani Socio-Cultural Organisation which has severally owned up to and justified massacres by Fulani herdsmen and gone scot free under the watch of Nigeria's Fulani led govt in which practically all, if not all the security agencies are headed by ethno/religious affiliates of the same right wing characters.
You are a historian. You are well informed of the dangers of appeasement of persistently dangerously belligerent characters.
Neville Chamberlain's efforts to appease Hitler before WW2 are well known.
You are also informed about the use of the janjaweed in Sudan by President Omar Al Bashir, the same line being towed today by Buhari. Miyetti Allah and the Fulani herdsmen militia.
Efforts like yours to claim, in spite of all evidence to the contrary, that all is well, will not dissuade the right wing Fulani warlords, as the rivers of blood they are spilling makes clear, as they persistently struggle to manipulate govt policy in tandem with the massacres they are committing, trying to force Nigerians to bend to their dominance in order to gain respite from this incessant bloodletting.
The only way they can be made to pull back is persistent push back from Nigerians, like the recurrent outcries over the various moves to hoist Fulani herdsmen settlements on other Nigerians, the latest being the RUGA plan.
Fora are badly needed for these issues to be aired and debated as is done here.
Its wise to prevent extreme attitudes but your stated stance looks like a flight from reality.
You might have blocked my post on the possibility of all out war in response to the war already declared on unwitting Nigerians by the right wing Fulani. The imminence of that all out war is already staring us in the face.
Safer to raise issues and debate them than claim that the house that is Nigeria is not already on fire by right wing ethnic supremacists.
SW, SE, Midwest, Southern Kaduna, the entire nation is crying out under the burden of Fulani herdsmen terrorism and you are declaring that "Evil and Good are equally distributed all over the country. All ethnicities have their evil leaders"?
Thanks
Oluwatoyin Vincent Adepoju
--On Sun, 7 Jul 2019 at 17:10, Toyin Falola <toyinfalola@austin.utexas.edu> wrote:
Some postings on the Fulani that I rejected have bothered on hate speech.
Let us all exercise caution and to remember the following:
1. Evil and Good are equally distributed all over the country. All ethnicities have their evil leaders.
2. The victims are the poor
3. Hate speech can trigger genocide
Moderator
Sent from my iPhone
--
Listserv moderated by Toyin Falola, University of Texas at Austin
To post to this group, send an email to USAAfricaDialogue@googlegroups.com
To subscribe to this group, send an email to USAAfricaDialogue+subscribe@googlegroups.com
Current archives at http://groups.google.com/group/USAAfricaDialogue
Early archives at http://www.utexas.edu/conferences/africa/ads/index.html
---
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "USA Africa Dialogue Series" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to usaafricadialogue+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/usaafricadialogue/A9F568E3-E409-4A9E-A9F8-C3B22AACC917%40austin.utexas.edu.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Listserv moderated by Toyin Falola, University of Texas at Austin
To post to this group, send an email to USAAfricaDialogue@googlegroups.com
To subscribe to this group, send an email to USAAfricaDialogue+subscribe@googlegroups.com
Current archives at http://groups.google.com/group/USAAfricaDialogue
Early archives at http://www.utexas.edu/conferences/africa/ads/index.html
---
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "USA Africa Dialogue Series" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to usaafricadialogue+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/usaafricadialogue/CALUsqTSABkKQjqc_KTV31C_WgJD08yF%2BxozEiDas5WUJK3wYLQ%40mail.gmail.com.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Listserv moderated by Toyin Falola, University of Texas at Austin
To post to this group, send an email to USAAfricaDialogue@googlegroups.com
To subscribe to this group, send an email to USAAfricaDialogue+subscribe@googlegroups.com
Current archives at http://groups.google.com/group/USAAfricaDialogue
Early archives at http://www.utexas.edu/conferences/africa/ads/index.html
---
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "USA Africa Dialogue Series" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to usaafricadialogue+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/usaafricadialogue/9772095.2577589.1562531144734%40mail.yahoo.com.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Listserv moderated by Toyin Falola, University of Texas at Austin
To post to this group, send an email to USAAfricaDialogue@googlegroups.com
To subscribe to this group, send an email to USAAfricaDialogue+subscribe@googlegroups.com
Current archives at http://groups.google.com/group/USAAfricaDialogue
Early archives at http://www.utexas.edu/conferences/africa/ads/index.html
---
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "USA Africa Dialogue Series" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to usaafricadialogue+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/usaafricadialogue/VI1PR04MB449307ED37DDCF54D4BC909DA6F60%40VI1PR04MB4493.eurprd04.prod.outlook.com.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Listserv moderated by Toyin Falola, University of Texas at Austin
To post to this group, send an email to USAAfricaDialogue@googlegroups.com
To subscribe to this group, send an email to USAAfricaDialogue+subscribe@googlegroups.com
Current archives at http://groups.google.com/group/USAAfricaDialogue
Early archives at http://www.utexas.edu/conferences/africa/ads/index.html
---
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "USA Africa Dialogue Series" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to usaafricadialogue+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/usaafricadialogue/369089311.3020915.1562646257864%40mail.yahoo.com.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Listserv moderated by Toyin Falola, University of Texas at Austin
To post to this group, send an email to USAAfricaDialogue@googlegroups.com
To subscribe to this group, send an email to USAAfricaDialogue+subscribe@googlegroups.com
Current archives at http://groups.google.com/group/USAAfricaDialogue
Early archives at http://www.utexas.edu/conferences/africa/ads/index.html
---
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "USA Africa Dialogue Series" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to usaafricadialogue+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/usaafricadialogue/CALUsqTT1ugRh4mxZQkrY29J6muYDnBQHnMSTg7r5-gZA_f%3DKjg%40mail.gmail.com.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
No comments:
Post a Comment