On Saturday, 28 December 2019 19:54:20 UTC+1, Ibrahim Abdullah wrote:
Cornelius:This is sheer dogon turanchi--hot air! Am not an Islamic scholar; I will never be invited to SA to give a lecture. You really don't know me so please don't stretch your imagination to invent a personae that is alien to my person.Sent from my iPhoneOn 28 Dec 2019, at 4:22 PM, Cornelius Hamelberg <cornelius...@gmail.com> wrote:--Professor Ibrahim Abdullah,
OK, so, you're not a" Sheikh". Please forgive me. I thought that in this discussion the title Sheikh Ibrahim Abdullah, would sound pleasing to both your ears, would boost your ego and bolster your certainties over your uncertainties. When you're invited to deliver a lecture in Riyadh, about corruption in the ummah – or indeed corruption in Nigeria and you are introduced as Sheikh Ibrahim Abdullah I'm sure that even before you begin to speak you'll already get a standing ovation, because it is to be expected that truth and only truth would be spouting out of your mouth, whereas a mere Western-educated Professor Ibrahim Abdullah that's disconnected from the Jami'ah Islamiyya might not quote the Quran that says to the faithful, "Produce your proof if you are truthful
As you know, we Saro people and some of the Naija people too like awarding titles, even to some of the undeserving. What about "Mallam"? Baba Kadiri addressed you as" Mallam". Any objection to that? What's in a name?
I heard some Pakistani-looking fellows in the supermarket, speaking some kind of Punjabi so I approached them and after a short conversation I asked their leader, "Are you a Muslim?" He answered, emphatically, "No. I'm a human being. Thank God!" Turns out they were a bunch of Hindus. Like Modi & the BJP. Universal Hindu principle: No beef. No "Halal". Cow holy. Holy cow. Leaves room for the conjecture that there must have been a bunch of Hindu mushrikun in the mixed multitude that followed Moses out of Egypt, and that it must have been those guys that were later on responsible for the sin of the golden calf.
My dear friend Adl Hamza (an Egyptian from Mansura) defines a Muslim as one who does not lie. He says, and I quote him, "A Muslim does not lie!" – and so far in this thread, you have not lied - you have merely shifted all the blame on that contaminated Coker Report. And that is the apotheosis of this discussion. We are not going to get any further with you, without completely disembowelling the accursed Coker Report. That it has already been vastly discredited is not going to get anywhere with you, you are adamant and as far as you are concerned, never mind the circumstances in which it was conducted, you believe that The Coker Report was written in indelible, uncorrupted ink, maybe, second only to the Holy Quran, for veracity.
No doubt, Jesus, son of Mary was also a supporter of Zionism, he was human after all, just like Ibrahim Abdullah, Moses ( Ochonu) you can even say that "he was no saint" even if in Peter's dream he ( Jesus ) was seen walking on water and till today there are people who misunderstand -as Dr Ben Carson put it – and this applies to perceptions of AWO too :
"Haters will see you walking on water and say it's because you can't swim. Even if you dance on water, your enemies will accuse you of raising dust."
My last word to you on this matter: an explanation (e.g. of the trinity) is not a proof, nor is an accusation, suspicion, falsification, a prejudiced report, a trial in a kangaroo court , the trial of Jesus, Socrates, Mandela, Kenyatta, Biko - and you know the flaws in the Beoku-Betts, the Percy Davies Inquiry and the host of other inquiries in our various countries , since Coker's politically motivated and the questions that Baba Kadiri asked and which neither Professor, Sheikh or Mallam is able to answer adequately :
"If Coker Commission had discovered that Awolowo stole or misappropriated Western Region funds when he was premier there up till 1959 when he handed over to Akintola, he would have been tried in court and sentenced to imprisonment. When theft crime could not be fixed on Awolowo, that was why the Federal Government resorted to treasonable felony against him."
Bottom line: You are deliberately being both unreasonable and unfair:
I/ we should "Get the report and read it" because it's too much trouble for you to dig up the relevant sections and post them – not that we have to believe a single letter in the confounded Report. Here it is: Report of the Coker Commission of Inquiry into the Affairs of Certain Statutory Corporations in Western Nigeria, 1962
It's the same as my last word to my Tanzanian friend ( a Jesus fan/fanatic ) who wants me to waste my time reading some useless hocus-pocus science fiction material known as The Book of Urantia . I guess he's been reading all his life and still hasn't come across what I would recommend that he read The Tanya ! That would be reading something worthwhile
On Saturday, 28 December 2019 13:02:39 UTC+1, Ibrahim Abdullah wrote:Cornelius:Go get the report and read it. This is no classroom. I made a comment and I stand by it. Am not a Sheikh---don't cloth me in borrowed robes---I mean something when I say it. And I won't be the first go make such a claim; and am not here to score cheap points. If you think I have the time to rummage through documents I acquired forty years ago while in graduate school you should have another think coming. This forum is not a court of law--and I don't spend my time unnecessarily trying to prove this or that.Find the report and disprove my claim--this dogon turanchi won't take you anywhere.Sent from my iPhoneOn 28 Dec 2019, at 3:07 AM, Cornelius Hamelberg <cornelius...@gmail.com> wrote:--You could repent and apologise.
This is not about hagiography or sacred dust or claims about other mortal/immortal words, including The Coker Commission or indeed The Beoku-Betts Commission as "the word of God".
You are a historian and a professor of history, you have probably written a few biographies and political post-mortems worth reading, but whether or not you have published them to make them accessible to those who could be interested is not the main matter here. The main matter here is that you have made a public error in judgment (which you are entitled to do since you are not masoom or one of the infallible) and as a historian, you know that judgment is based on some value system/s, facts ( variously defined) and that interpretation too is based on context, circumstances, motivation/ niyat…
In the Book of Job// Judaism's The Book of Job - "how bad things happen to good people") and elsewhere, making false accusations, testifying against the righteous is one of the functions of Satan, the accuser and his agents. Likewise, in your case, it's not good enough (it's repugnant) that you publish or publicize some poisonous, malicious, malignant, hideous rumour/ last judgement, such as that "Awo chopped cocoa profit well well ", aimed at desecrating the sacred memory of Chief Obafemi Jeremiah Oyeniyi Awolowo…
You cannot make such heinous accusations - without proof. You cannot bear false witness against thy neighbour and hope that you will get away with it (adding insult to injury) on the grounds that it's all in some controversial Coker Commission Report – which it isn't and so in the final analysis, the onus of proof should be on you, the Satanic accuser. You must furnish us with the evidence in black and white and you must do so by taking your own medicine:
"Learn to check sources---don't wait for those making claims to substantiate their claims---they may not have the tools or the wherewithal."
You can't have your cake and eat it too.
Your very first remark was that "Awo was no saint. Coker Commission report is there for all to see." Baba Kadiri was quick to challenge you: "Agreed, Awo was not a saint, but did Coker Commission report prove that he was not a saint? If yes, please share with us how Coker Commission proved it."
Yet, up to now, you (Ibrahim Abdullah) have been reluctant to support any of your vilifications by quoting the aforementioned document which itself, as explained earlier was calculated (in the then prevailing circumstances, politically motivated) to tarnish AWO's good name. All you do is that you go on and on beating the same drum, ad nauseum, unnecessarily dragging the Chief's good name in the mud, attributing evil to him and relegating his good name and good works to the category of the corrupt as if he is like other men of your ilk.
De mortuis nil nisi bonum – and to that end even for those resting in the eternal perfect peace, you are aware of the law about defamation and the law about libel and slander.
May history continue to judge AWO favourably. The letter under our purview, is bitter, pessimistic, not cynical and in the end hopefully hoping in GOD, he says it all so eloquently, about that polity and he was very far from being non-committal when he said so unequivocally that he did not want to be a part of it. It was not a last will and testament - such as Moses' farewell address or the Prophet of Islam's last sermon.
The trouble with Nigeria and the trouble with a lot of places elsewhere is succinctly expressed in that letter and the message is clear, we could take it to heart and up till today it is up to us to do the right thing about the sorry mess for which we are responsible:
"as long as Nigerians remain what they are, nothing clean, principled, ethical, and idealistic can work with them. And Nigerians will remain what they are, unless the evils which now dominate their hearts, at all levels and in all sectors of our political, business and governmental activities are exorcised. But I venture to assert that they will not be exorcised, and indeed they will be firmly entrenched, unless God Himself imbues a vast majority of us with a revolutionary change of attitude to life and politics or, unless the dialectic processes which have been at work for some twenty years now, perforce, make us perceive the abominable filth that abounds in our society, to the end that an inexorable abhorrence of it will be quickened in our hearts and impel us to make drastic changes for the better. There is, of course, an alternative option open to us. To succumb to permanent social instability and chaos"
On Tuesday, 24 December 2019 20:46:19 UTC+1, Ibrahim Abdullah wrote:Awo was no saint. Coker Commission report is there for all to see.
Sent from my iPad
> On Dec 24, 2019, at 10:35 AM, Tunji Olaopa <tolao...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Reading Papa Awo's letter declining to serve on IBB's Political Bureau in 1986 again, and with the clear declining fortune of the Nigeria Project, I woke up this morning wondering, did the sage saw something about the future that we are in that we were perhaps too blinded to see?
>
> RESTORING GOVERNMENTAL AND SOCIAL ORDER - CHIEF OBAFEMI AWOLOWO
>
> In 1986, former President Ibrahim Babangida had asked Pa Awolowo to provide input into charting a New Social Order for Nigeria via a National Debate. A couple of my bosom friends have over the last few days reminded me of the force and depth of Pa Awolowo reply:
>
> "Dear Sir, I received your letter of February 28, 1986, and sincerely thank you for doing me the honour of inviting me to contribute to the National Political Debate. The purpose of the debate is to clarify our thoughts in our search for a new social order. It is, therefore, meet and proper that all those who have something to contribute should do so. I do fervently and will continue fervently to pray that I may be proved wrong. For something within me tells me, loud and clear, that we have embarked on a fruitless search. At the end of the day, when we imagine that the new order is here, we would be terribly disappointed. In other words, at the threshold of our New Social Order, we would see for ourselves that, as long as Nigerians remain what they are, nothing clean, principled, ethical, and idealistic can work with them. And Nigerians will remain what they are, unless the evils which now dominate their hearts, at all levels and in all sectors of our political, business and governmental activities are exorcised. But I venture to assert that they will not be exorcised, and indeed they will be firmly entrenched, unless God Himself imbues a vast majority of us with a revolutionary change of attitude to life and politics or, unless the dialectic processes which have been at work for some twenty years now, perforce, make us perceive the abominable filth that abounds in our society, to the end that an inexorable abhorrence of it will be quickened in our hearts and impel us to make drastic changes for the better. There is, of course, an alternative option open to us. To succumb to permanent social instability and chaos. On the premises, I beg to decline your invitation. I am yours truly, Obafemi Awolowo."
>
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