RE: USA Africa Dialogue Series - Professor Olufemi Taiwo: "Africa Must be Modern” ?

OK,. Ken Thanks for the clarification.






Professor Gloria Emeagwali
History Department
CCSU. New Britain. CT 06050
africahistory.net
vimeo.com/user5946750/videos
Gloria Emeagwali's Documentaries on
Africa and the African Diaspora
________________________________________
From: usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com [usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of kenneth harrow [harrow@msu.edu]
Sent: Tuesday, June 16, 2015 4:55 PM
To: usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: USA Africa Dialogue Series - Professor Olufemi Taiwo: "Africa Must be Modern" ?

hi gloria
you are mistaken in stating i was silently endorsing the use of drones.
my point was to identify belmokhtar as an example of someone who was not
to be admired, despite his anti-western stance. i have opposed the use
of drones, on this list, zillions of times, and haven't change a whit on
this.
in fact, the line i wrote, which you cite, merely reiterates my
criticisms, and my criticism of belmokhtar doesn't mean i approve of the
use of drones, or any other extrajudicial means of killing him. in the
larger scheme of things, i am completely opposed to the "war on
terrorism." obama, who campaigned against that ideological framing of
u.s. policy turned out to be its biggest supporter, which is the basis
for my deepest disappointment in him.
ken


On 6/16/15 10:36 PM, Emeagwali, Gloria (History) wrote:
> "...... whatever criticisms might be leveled against the west, say
> with the use of drones or guantanamo abuses, that doesn't legitimize al
> qaeda in the maghreb with its own deplorable actions and politics."
>
>
> This statement is quite true. I never said I endorsed AQIM and their war of terror.
>
> But I found your silent endorsement of the use of extra-judicial drones a bit worrisome.
> I looked at the headline and wondered whether you were celebrating the use
> of the drones or the death of the man or both. I am still puzzled.
>
> Gloria
> ________________________________________
> From: usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com [usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of kenneth harrow [harrow@msu.edu]
> Sent: Tuesday, June 16, 2015 2:45 AM
> To: usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: USA Africa Dialogue Series - Professor Olufemi Taiwo: "Africa Must be Modern" ?
>
> hi gloria
> your message is a bit obscure to me, but if the core is that western
> imperialist actions are deplorable, we share the same views. on the
> other hand, whatever criticisms might be leveled against the west, say
> with the use of drones or guantanamo abuses, that doesn't legitimize al
> qaeda in the maghreb with its own deplorable actions and politics.
> let's make it simple; during the war in algeria in the 80s you had the
> fln and fis. both sides acted in deplorable ways; neither deserved
> anyone's support. belmokhtar is an example i was offering of someone
> whose own anti-western actions did not earn him any praises.
> i want to arrive at revisions of revolutionary thought that allow us to
> ask questions of movements we might otherwise totally support. having
> read about how che ordered killings during the revolution, i want to ask
> about how the ethics of the movement marked it, how they affected the
> long term outcome in cuba, its own intolerances. despite its gains.
> when the anc was discovered to have been torturing opponents in the
> camps it maintained outside s africa, i want to ask the same questions,
> not simply say anything goes.
> i am questioning kwame's rhetoric here in the name of a more open-minded
> radical thought whose examplars i've cited earlier with people like
> mouffe and laclau. our list discusses more than nigerian politics, at
> times; we get into broader african or world politics. what is the basis
> for our political claims?
>
> ken
>
> On 6/16/15 12:03 AM, Emeagwali, Gloria (History) wrote:
>> Ken, I am not sure as to what you are celebrating here.
>> Is it the use of extra-judicial drones in killing someone, or the death of a human rights violator?
>> Since you are a human rights advocate I assume that it is the latter.
>>
>> I would add 5 more groups of refugees to your list:
>>
>> 1.There are those who are the victims of western propaganda that paints Europe as a land of milk and honey and everywhere else sheer hell on earth. Here the West is victim of its own disinformation.
>>
>> 2. Victims of the war against Gadaffi.
>>
>> 3. Victims of Boko Haram - which has wreaked havoc in the Chad Basin. I suspect that a lot of refugees from Northeast
>>
>> 4. . Islamic State sleeper cells perhaps. No tangible evidence. Sheer speculation.
>>
>> 5. Africans in search of the New World.
>>
>>
>> I really don't know about Eritrea. My friends on the Ethiopian side say it is a place of horror but
>> more info is needed. The political enemy of the day is usually smeared with radioactive paint.
>> At one time BL was a nice man and ally, and so too Saddam Hussein,
>> Papa Doc, Marcos, Suharto etc.
>>
>>
>> I get worried though when Eritrea prefers to back the 1929 and 1959
>> colonial era treaty that gave Egypt the lion's share of Nile Waters. That must be coming from
>> questionable leadership.
>>
>> Tales of political prisoners in Guantanamo - style setting are also unsettling.
>> Not sure whether he eliminates his political prisoners by a faceless robot, though. He probably disposes of them
>> in a sealed ship on the Red sea. More investigation needed on this one.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Professor Gloria Emeagwali
>> History Department
>> CCSU. New Britain. CT 06050
>> africahistory.net
>> vimeo.com/user5946750/videos
>> Gloria Emeagwali's Documentaries on
>> Africa and the African Diaspora
>>
>> ________________________________
>> From: usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com [usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of kenneth harrow [harrow@msu.edu]
>> Sent: Monday, June 15, 2015 6:32 AM
>> To: usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: Re: USA Africa Dialogue Series - Professor Olufemi Taiwo: "Africa Must be Modern" ?
>>
>> it seems to me we need careful language and criteria to assess the figures/movements that deploy anti-western rhetoric so as to not qualify any and every anti-western as some kind of positive anti-imperialist movement. a revolutionary movement can be no different from a totalitarian or effectively imperialist one, when it assigns to itself the position of absolute holder of truth.
>> one kills in the name of the revolution, but if the only authority is one's own power, how is it not effectively an authoritarianism that is as bad as any other.
>> here might be an example, from today's bbc:
>> Mokhtar Belmokhtar: Top Islamist 'killed' in US strike
>> Media caption Tom Bateman: "The Pentagon described the air strike as successful"
>> Libya after Gaddafi
>> A top Islamist militant who ordered a deadly attack on an Algerian gas plant two years ago has been killed in a US air strike in Libya, officials say.
>>
>> Mokhtar Belmokhtar was killed in the eastern city of Ajdabiya, a statement from Libya's government said.
>>
>> The US says Belmokhtar was targeted and the strike was successful, but it is assessing the operation's results and would give details "as appropriate".
>>
>> Mokhtar Belmokhtar<http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-21061480>'s death has been reported many times in the past.
>>
>> Notoriety
>>
>> Born in Algeria, Belmokhtar was a former senior figure in al-Qaeda in the Islamic Maghreb (AQIM), but left to form his own militia.
>>
>> He gained notoriety with the attack on the In Amenas gas plant in Algeria in 2013, when about 800 people were taken hostage and 40 killed, most of them foreigners, including six Britons and three Americans.
>>
>> The US has filed terror charges against him and officials said they believed he remained a threat to Western interests.
>>
>> "Belmokhtar has a long history of leading terrorist activities as a member of AQIM, is the operational leader of the al-Qaeda-associated al-Murabitoun organisation in north-west Africa, and maintains his personal allegiance to al-Qaeda," said Pentagon spokesman Col Steve Warren.
>>
>> read the rest here: http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-33129838
>> ken
>>
>>
>> On 6/15/15 12:39 AM, kwame zulu shabazz wrote:
>> there are still many West African immigrants. According to reports Eritreans typically say they want to avoid the mandatory military draft.
>>
>> kzs
>>
>>
>> On Jun 14, 2015, at 4:09 PM, kenneth harrow <harrow@msu.edu<mailto:harrow@msu.edu>> wrote:
>>
>> there are two sets of refugees now flooding the boats to europe, desperate refugees fleeing bad oppressive violent circumstances. etritreans and syrians.
>> ken
>>
>> On 6/14/15 2:15 PM, Folu Ogundimu wrote:
>> Don't uphold Eritrea as a paragon of a moral, modern African state, please. We can do better than live in Gulags and hail oppressors as patriotic leaders.
>>
>> F.
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On Jun 13, 2015, at 9:45 PM, kwame zulu shabazz <kwameshabazz@gmail.com<mailto:kwameshabazz@gmail.com>> wrote:
>>
>> Agree, sister Gloria.
>>
>> And when African leaders chart a path of self-determination they are assassinated, overthrown, smeared or otherwise undermined--frequently with western connivance. The most recent example being Eritrea now labeled a "brutal dictatorship"<https://twitter.com/kzshabazz/status/609780828080476161> by the US govt.
>>
>> I've ordered Taiwo's book and was able to read the intro and a substantial part of Chapter 1. Interestingly, the author says he identified with Marxist principles in Nigeria. He then went to Canada to school only to discover that capitalism wasn't that bad after all. Modernity is western thing (no mention of the ongoing oppression of First Nations/Indigenous Canadiens). Yes, he concedes, the west has got some things wrong, slavery, for example. However, because they have embraced individualism and the related principle of individual rights, western nations have shown the capacity to correct themselves. He correctly notes that all societies have gone through a communalistic stage. Africans, according to Taiwo, are stuck in this phase thus impeding their development.
>>
>> African Americans didn't have to invent anything new in their demand for equal rights, they simply insisted that America live up to its lofty principles of modernity. I agree. But that isn't the whole story. He is unaware that communism played a key role in challenging racism in the Jim Crow South<http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=123771194>. A role that was only reluctantly taken up by the NAACP. He is critical of the conservative American right and what he see as the turn from modern ideas. He mentions specifically mass incarceration, the assault of voting rights, etc.
>>
>> Taiwo believes that "Africans" haven't embraced "modernity" because they focus incessantly on its negative aspects whilst ignoring the many positive elements. He seems to miss that contemporary geopolitics have also played a significant role in what he calls Africa's "backwardsness"; that western development depends on African underdevelopment; that the principles of modernity didn't just "correct" gross injustices. Rather "modernity" America required the brutal oppression of Indigenous Americans and Africans. That oppression is less brutish but ongoing. Just as development in the west depends on Africa's raw materials presently.
>>
>> kzs
>>
>>
>> On Jun 13, 2015, at 3:00 PM, Emeagwali, Gloria (History) <emeagwali@mail.ccsu.edu<mailto:emeagwali@mail.ccsu.edu>> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Is Taiwo calling for Africa to embrace neo-liberalism, cut-throat capitalism,
>>
>> western hegemony, World Governance (unipolarity), extra-judicial drones,
>>
>> a military - prison-industrial system, Big Pharma and its toxic pharmaceuticals,
>>
>> corporatism and rule by corporations etc.
>>
>>
>>
>> These features may be considered part of modernity
>>
>> by some analysts, rightly or wrongly.
>>
>>
>>
>> That is why I look forward eagerly to the definition of modernity.
>>
>>
>>
>> Since you have read the book, Pablo, kindly shed some light on this
>>
>> so that we don't jump to the wrong conclusions.
>>
>>
>>
>> G
>>
>>
>>
>> Professor Gloria Emeagwali
>> History Department
>> CCSU. New Britain. CT 06050
>> africahistory.net<http://africahistory.net/>
>> vimeo.com/user5946750/videos<http://vimeo.com/user5946750/videos>
>> Gloria Emeagwali's Documentaries on
>> Africa and the African Diaspora
>>
>> ________________________________
>> From: usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com<mailto:usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com> [usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com<mailto:usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com>] On Behalf Of Pablo [pidahosa@yorku.ca<mailto:pidahosa@yorku.ca>]
>> Sent: Saturday, June 13, 2015 3:11 PM
>> To: usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com<mailto:usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com>
>> Subject: Re: USA Africa Dialogue Series - Professor Olufemi Taiwo: "Africa Must be Modern" ?
>>
>> It would help if people read Femi's book.
>>
>> Pablo
>>
>> On 2015-06-13 10:49 AM, Anunoby, Ogugua wrote:
>> I agree. I will add exploring modernity, warts and all too.
>> oa
>>
>> From: usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com<mailto:usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com><mailto:usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com> [mailto:usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Emeagwali, Gloria (History)
>> Sent: Friday, June 12, 2015 2:28 PM
>> To: 'usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com<mailto:usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com><mailto:usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com>'; Wanazuoni
>> Subject: RE: USA Africa Dialogue Series - Professor Olufemi Taiwo: "Africa Must be Modern" ?
>>
>> I hope he spent quite a while defining what he considered 'modernity' to be.
>> GE
>>
>> From: usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com<mailto:usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com><mailto:usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com> [mailto:usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com]
>> Sent: Thursday, June 11, 2015 8:00 PM
>> To: Wanazuoni
>> Cc: Waafrika
>> Subject: USA Africa Dialogue Series - Professor Olufemi Taiwo: "Africa Must be Modern" ?
>>
>> "The apprehension that African nations feel about embracing modernity, which has hindered their economic and political development, is the focus of a new book by Olúfémi Táíwò, professor of Africana studies in the College of Arts and Sciences. In "Africa Must be Modern," Táíwò explores the current problems and political climate in African countries and their progress in recent years; and compares their growth to similar countries in other regions of the world. Costa Rica, for example, preserves its forests and earns substantial revenue from ecotourism, while Liberia risks losing its forests to logging. While the two countries have similar populations, Costa Ricans can expect to live two decades longer than Liberians. "Similar comparisons can be made of, say, Chile and Zambia, Ethiopia and the Philippines, Brazil and Nigeria, and so on," he writes. These comparisons support Táíwò's argument that modernity is necessary for African nations' survival: "If we would compare ourselves with others, rather than differentiate ourselves from them, we might be shamed into action that will move us forward with the rest of humanity." - Africana professor issues call for modernity in Africa | Cornell Chronicle<http://www.news.cornell.edu/stories/2015/05/africana-professor-issues-call-modernity-africa>
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>> <http://www.news.cornell.edu/stories/2015/05/africana-professor-issues-call-modernity-africa>
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>> Africana professor issues call for modernity in Africa |...<http://www.news.cornell.edu/stories/2015/05/africana-professor-issues-call-modernity-africa>
>> TáíwòThe apprehension that African nations feel about embracing modernity, which has hindered their economic and political development, is the focus of a new book...
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>> View on www.news.cornell.edu<http://www.news.cornell.edu/><http://www.news.cornell.edu/stories/2015/05/africana-professor-issues-call-modernity-africa>
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>> "In a forthright and uncompromising manner, Olúfémi Táíwò explores Africa's hostility toward modernity and how that hostility has impeded economic development and social and political transformation. What has to change for Africa to be able to respond to the challenges of modernity and globalization? Táíwò insists that Africa can renew itself only by fully engaging with democracy and capitalism and by mining its untapped intellectual resources. While many may not agree with Táíwò's positions, they will be unable to ignore what he says. This is a bold exhortation for Africa to come into the 21st century" - Africa Must Be Modern: A Manifesto<http://www.amazon.com/Africa-Must-Be-Modern-Manifesto/dp/0253012759>
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>> Africa Must Be Modern: A Manifesto<http://www.amazon.com/Africa-Must-Be-Modern-Manifesto/dp/0253012759>
>> Africa Must Be Modern: A Manifesto [Olúfémi Táíwò] on Amazon.com<http://amazon.com/>. *FREE* shipping on qualifying offers. In a forthright and uncompromising manner, Olúfémi Táíwò explores Africa's hostility toward modernity and how that hostility has impeded economic development and socia...
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>> View on www.amazon.com<http://www.amazon.com/><http://www.amazon.com/Africa-Must-Be-Modern-Manifesto/dp/0253012759>
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> --
> kenneth w. harrow
> faculty excellence advocate
> professor of english
> michigan state university
> department of english
> 619 red cedar road
> room C-614 wells hall
> east lansing, mi 48824
> ph. 517 803 8839
> harrow@msu.edu
>
>
> --
> Listserv moderated by Toyin Falola, University of Texas at Austin
> To post to this group, send an email to USAAfricaDialogue@googlegroups.com
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> Early archives at http://www.utexas.edu/conferences/africa/ads/index.html
> ---
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>

--
kenneth w. harrow
faculty excellence advocate
professor of english
michigan state university
department of english
619 red cedar road
room C-614 wells hall
east lansing, mi 48824
ph. 517 803 8839
harrow@msu.edu


--
Listserv moderated by Toyin Falola, University of Texas at Austin
To post to this group, send an email to USAAfricaDialogue@googlegroups.com
To subscribe to this group, send an email to USAAfricaDialogue+subscribe@googlegroups.com
Current archives at http://groups.google.com/group/USAAfricaDialogue
Early archives at http://www.utexas.edu/conferences/africa/ads/index.html
---
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "USA Africa Dialogue Series" group.
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For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

--
Listserv moderated by Toyin Falola, University of Texas at Austin
To post to this group, send an email to USAAfricaDialogue@googlegroups.com
To subscribe to this group, send an email to USAAfricaDialogue+subscribe@googlegroups.com
Current archives at http://groups.google.com/group/USAAfricaDialogue
Early archives at http://www.utexas.edu/conferences/africa/ads/index.html
---
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For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.