Idowu, this is a SIMPLE MATTER! Confirm from other people whether your superficial take on Hilary's statement represents the true message, or whether my interpretation is FAVORED! Know that I will not yield to your insinuations about my pathogen lab, NIDO or any other distractions because they are petty and demonstrate your lack of focus on issues. Some of you should realize by now that there are some Nigerians you can't just be dangling all over the place with your confused, demented and unintelligible minds. It is obviously discomforting and frustrating for you probably because some of you falsely believe you are smarter than the rest of us (common people) or what you truly are; but realize that some of us are very discerning and know WHAT IS RIGHT in accord with available facts! So some of us won't STAND or stomach your imbecilities, banality and basal sentimentalisms that are designed to mislead and cause distractions in a potentially GREAT Society! Bye! JUI
From: NaijaObserver@yahoogroups.com [mailto:NaijaObserver@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of idowu
Sent: Monday, November 01, 2010 8:07 PM
To: NaijaPolitics@yahoogroups.com; nigerianworldforum@yahoogroups.com; NaijaObserver@yahoogroups.com; naijaintellects@googlegroups.com; kalabariclan@yahoogroups.com; usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com; afenmai@yahoogroups.com; edo-nationality@yahoogroups.com; nigerianid@yahoogroups.com
Subject: ||NaijaObserver|| Re: [NaijaPolitics] RE: I'm ready for war to keep Nigeria's unity - Danjuma
JUI:
Only those who are used to laughing with pathogens instead of human beings will be laughing. Let me just honor Peter's advice that you are incorrigibly negative to facts.
If you like you can translate what have written to any language that will enhance your ability to comprehend facts.
If based on the context provided regarding Hillary Clinton's quote, then you are impossible. Hence, There is no need spreading my "pearls before pigs." What you've just shown to the generality of people in these fora, is that you have thin skin to facts and other people's view and such people are danger to any organization and democracy.
It is not surprising that NIDOA is moribund, when you have people like you as a member, whose mantra is only their ways or the highway.
I leave you to a relationship which you are comfortable, which is communicating with pathogen
Idowu
"Rebellion to tyrants is obedience to God." --Thomas Jefferson
"There may be times when we are powerless to prevent injustice, but there must never be a time when we fail to protest." -- Elie Wiesel
From: "Igietseme, Joseph (CDC/OID/NCPDCID)" <jbi8@cdc.gov>
To: "nigerianworldforum@yahoogroups.com" <NIgerianWorldForum@yahoogroups.com>; NaijaObserver@yahoogroups.com; naijaintellects@googlegroups.com; NaijaPolitics@yahoogroups.com; kalabariclan@yahoogroups.com; usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com; afenmai@yahoogroups.com; edo-nationality@yahoogroups.com; nigerianid@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Mon, November 1, 2010 5:06:28 PM
Subject: [NaijaPolitics] RE: I'm ready for war to keep Nigeria's unity - Danjuma
Idowu,
I am sure there are people laughing at all of these shenanigans you are putting up about this simple statement from Hilary about Nigeria. It is obvious to us now that you blindly issued the statement to support your views about SNG and Nigeria without appreciating its TRUE (not superficial) message; I explained to you that its meaning is that some of you should QUIT the confusion and distractions you are causing Nigeria, by advocating forums and discussions on the DIFFERENCES among Nigerians or whether Nigeria should even be one nation; rather Nigerians should focus on common nation building and how to move people with common human needs and common destiny forward. What is TOO DIFFICULT for you to understand here? Why are you still stagnated on your superficial take on Hilary's message to Nigerians? The Nigerian context is clear; the targeted ethnic jingoists are there; you know them; so what is your POINT now! Let me know if you want me to say it in Edo, Yoruba, Igbo, Hausa, Igalla, Igbirra, Tiv or Nupe! Or you may contact Hilary directly! Take care. JUI
From: NIgerianWorldForum@yahoogroups.com [mailto:NIgerianWorldForum@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of idowu
Sent: Monday, November 01, 2010 5:53 PM
To: NaijaObserver@yahoogroups.com; naijaintellects@googlegroups.com; NaijaPolitics@yahoogroups.com; nigerianworldforum@yahoogroups.com; kalabariclan@yahoogroups.com; usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com; afenmai@yahoogroups.com; edo-nationality@yahoogroups.com; nigerianid@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [NIgerianWorldForum] Re: ||NaijaObserver|| RE: RE: I'm ready for war to keep Nigeria's unity - Danjuma
Joe:
I have provided you upteenth time the context of Madam Secretary Clinton quotation. I am not surprised that you could see anything beyond your own perceived way of seeing things. It is either your way or the highway.
See below:
First and foremost, we are told in basic English language class, that when you see a quote, the first question should be what is the context?
Your assumption and response neglected the context of what a foreigner in Madam Secretary saw,-- a country retrogressing and lack common humanity and destiny. The question that is expected from a scientific mind should be, what are the factors reponsible for this schism, and how can this be corrected.
This is Madam Secretary's context
"We recognize that Nigeria is at a crossroad and it is imperative that citizens be involved and engaged in helping to chart the future of this great nation," she said.
"Today I am in Nigeria, a country that produces two million barrels of oil a day, has the seventh largest oil reserve than any country in the world. But according to the UN, the poverty rate in Nigeria has gone up from 46 percent to 76 percent over the last 13years," Clinton said.
She gave the reasons why Nigeria was still at a crossroad, including the destructive legacy of colonialism, devastating civil wars and other external forces.
"But as President Barrack Obama said in Ghana, the future of Africans is up to Africans and the future of Nigeria is up to Nigerians," she said.
Clinton further said, "The most immediate source of the disconnection between Nigeria's wealth and its poverty is the failure of its governance at the local, state and federal levels."
"The 100,200 million barrels of oil importation are staggering, but they do not tell you how many hospitals and roads could have been built. They do not tell you how many schools could have been opened or how many Nigerians could have attended colleges," she said.
She quoted the World Bank recent statistics as stating that Nigeria had lost 300 billion dollars during the last three decades as a result of all of the problems listed above.
"Therefore it is imperative that we look at where Nigeria is today and in the spirit of friendship and partnership of a country that has made its own mistakes and had its own problems," she said.
"We look for ways to help one another, in particularly to help the people
So Madam Secretary now proposed a process which is for the nation consituent groups to find a way to address their differences, hence the quote.
The process here which you've failed to see is this "It is almost impossible for a nation to rise past a certain point if the constituent groups within the nation believe their differences"
Let me simplify this for you.
In every relationship there are partners (constituent groups) and each partner come up with different perception(believe their differences). To foster a firm union, you allow the people to air their dfferences and find out whether it is possible for the relationship to continue or not with mutual repsect and value for each constituent group.
So if you think that you can foster a relationship without allowing the people to discuss their differences, then you are either intellectually disingenuous or deliberately naive. It did not take a foreigner such as Hillary Clinton to know that Nigerians (stakeholders) has no buy-in in their union.
Idowu
"Rebellion to tyrants is obedience to God." --Thomas Jefferson
"There may be times when we are powerless to prevent injustice, but there must never be a time when we fail to protest." -- Elie Wiesel
From: "Igietseme, Joseph (CDC/OID/NCPDCID)" <jbi8@cdc.gov>
To: NaijaObserver@yahoogroups.com; naijaintellects@googlegroups.com; NaijaPolitics@yahoogroups.com; nigerianworldforum@yahoogroups.com; kalabariclan@yahoogroups.com; usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com; afenmai@yahoogroups.com; edo-nationality@yahoogroups.com; nigerianid@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Mon, November 1, 2010 3:15:17 PM
Subject: ||NaijaObserver|| RE: RE: I'm ready for war to keep Nigeria's unity - Danjuma
So has Idowu furnished a viable and tenable alternative interpretation to Madam Secretary of State Hilary Clinton's advice? I am reposting mine AGAIN!
"Madam Secretary is telling Nigerians or any society that it is :..impossible for a nation to rise past a certain point if the constituent groups within the nation believe their differences are more important [to discuss in SNG and similar gatherings] than their common humanity and common destiny [which will be nation building, progress and people's unity];""
We ARE WAITING! JUI
From: NaijaObserver@yahoogroups.com [mailto:NaijaObserver@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of idowu
Sent: Monday, November 01, 2010 5:10 PM
To: NaijaObserver@yahoogroups.com; naijaintellects@googlegroups.com; NaijaPolitics@yahoogroups.com; nigerianworldforum@yahoogroups.com; kalabariclan@yahoogroups.com; usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com; afenmai@yahoogroups.com; edo-nationality@yahoogroups.com; nigerianid@yahoogroups.com; isadus@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [Naijaintellects] RE: ||NaijaObserver|| RE: I'm ready for war to keep Nigeria's unity - Danjuma
Peter:
You know some people in this fora, if they are drowning and God send helps in different manner, will reject the helps, waiting to see God in person stretch out his hands to save them from drowning. So I had to look for other write ups from "non-dissidents" or "ethnic mongers" to explain SNC, may be their fish will bite.
Idowu
"Rebellion to tyrants is obedience to God." --Thomas Jefferson
"There may be times when we are powerless to prevent injustice, but there must never be a time when we fail to protest." -- Elie Wiesel
From: peter opara <ogbuonyeiro@yahoo.com>
To: naijaintellects@googlegroups.com; NaijaObserver@yahoogroups.com; NaijaPolitics@yahoogroups.com; nigerianworldforum@yahoogroups.com; kalabariclan@yahoogroups.com; usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com; afenmai@yahoogroups.com; edo-nationality@yahoogroups.com; nigerianid@yahoogroups.com; isadus@googlegroups.com
Sent: Mon, November 1, 2010 3:00:42 PM
Subject: Re: [Naijaintellects] RE: ||NaijaObserver|| RE: I'm ready for war to keep Nigeria's unity - Danjuma
| Idowu - You sure know how and where to dig these things up. Kudos. It is just that simple.
JUI: You are arguing against SNC from a very wrong premise. SNC is not what you thought and you've been arguing it is. Let me put across a quotation to you from one of the main proponents SNC "Each day that passes without our holding the Sovereign National Conference is a day spent in further watering the seeds of disenchantment from the innate desire of the nationalities. SNC is not a conference on how to divide. It is a conference by people who voluntarily wish to be together, but also who wish to work out a happy way of such being together - amicably and equitably. We do not have to wait until "things fall apart". Whether five months or five years, 50 months or 50 years, from now, a Sovereign National Conference, a conference for mutual benefit, mutual progress, is inevitable - if Nigeria, the type of Nigeria that we all really desire. The 'either' is that it must come, earlier better; the 'or' is also inevitable - if the SNC does not come." -Godwin Ndubusi Kanu I hope this will enlighten you, bringing you down from your utopian horse. Idowu "There may be times when we are powerless to prevent injustice, but there must never be a time when we fail to protest." -- Elie Wiesel From: "Igietseme, Joseph (CDC/OID/NCPDCID)" <jbi8@cdc.gov> Idowu, QUIT all these obnoxious and insinuative statements about people who have different opinions and interpretations of reigning matters. Do you want us to go VERIFY from Madam Secretary Hilary Clinton what she really meant by her statement? I bet my lunch that the interpretation will not be far from mine because I am reading her with an unbiased and national mind whereas, as ALWAYS, you are wearing your Ethnic goggles and ear-piece to perceive stuffs like this, which is unfortunate in this modern civilization with COMMON HUMANITY AND COMON DESTINY! The POINT here is that Madam Secretary is telling to Nigerians or any society that it is :..impossible for a nation to rise past a certain point if the constituent groups within the nation believe their differences are more important [to discuss in SNG and similar gatherings] than their common humanity and common destiny [which will be nation building, progress and people's unity]; you can't spin it any other way! As I have repeated, it has become clear that the purpose of SNG, as currently proposed, is to examine or determine whether the ethnic marriage that led to Nigeria nation is okay or acceptable after about 50 years; whether the terms of the marriage should be re-negotiated, and whether ethnic nationalities are the preferred options. You have not said I am WRONG, and that is what Hilary referred to as focusing on "differences", and many of us on this aisle have rightly branded such a discussion as a NEGATIVE emphasis on the differences people have, WHICH WILL not be productive; rather, we have CONSISTENTLY advocated emphasis on our COMMON HUMANITY AND COMMON NATIONAL DESTINY, whose realization will be anchored on building on the acquaintances and the common bonds Nigeria ethnic groups have developed over these years; electing capable leaders across ethnic lines; and encouraging Nigerians of the different ethnic groups to exercise the courage to call their corrupt and inept leaders to shape up, sit up and perform for their communities and Nigeria. Ethnic jingoism also provides a refuge for corrupt and inept leaders who will conveniently deal a false ethnic persecution card whenever they are called out for accountability. This is the TRUE picture of things; if you can't GET IT, SORRY! Look Idowu, there is a saying that if you give a set of data or information to different people who are assumed to be reasonable and share the SAME GOALS AND INTERESTS, they will analyze the data and come to VERY SIMILAR (IF NOT IDENTICAL) CONCLUSIONS, if their interests remain the same! Think about that and take care. JUI From: NaijaObserver@yahoogroups.com [mailto:NaijaObserver@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of idowu JUI: If what you wrote below is your understanding of Madam Secretary comment, then Nigeria has a long way to go. How can any inquisitive mind arrive at a conclusion without a process. Madam Secretary laid down a very clear process here for us to arrive at the final comclusion of common humanity and common destiny. First and foremost, we are told in basic English language class, that when you see a quote, the first question should be what is the context? You assumption and response neglected the context which is a foreigner in Madam Secretary saw a country retrogressing and lack common humanity and destiny. The question that is expected from a scientific mind should be what are the factors reponsible for this schism and how can this be corrected. So Madam Secretary now proposed a process which is for the nation consituent groups to find away to address their differences, hence the quote. The process here which you've failed to see is this "It is almost impossible for a nation to rise past a certain point if the constituent groups within the nation believe their differences" Let me simplify this for you. In every relationship there are partners (constituent groups) and each partner come up with different perception(believe their differences). To foster a firm union, you allow the people to air their dfferences and find out whether it is possible for the relationship to continue or not with mutual repsect and value for each constituent group. So if you think that you can foster a relationship without allowing the people to discuss their differences, then you are either intellectually disingenuous or deliberately naive. It did not take a foreigner such as Hillary Clinton to know that Nigerians (stakeholders) has no buy-in in their union. Idowu "There may be times when we are powerless to prevent injustice, but there must never be a time when we fail to protest." -- Elie Wiesel From: "Igietseme, Joseph (CDC/OID/NCPDCID)" <jbi8@cdc.gov> "It is almost impossible for a nation to rise past a certain point if the constituent groups within the nation believe their differences are more important than their common humanity and common destiny."-Hillary Clinton on Nigeria (2009). Great that actually VALIDATES the position of those of us on this aisle because it underscores how ethnic jingoism (fanning of differences) has stagnated Nigeria to continue to spin on her wheels. Look, to the best of our knowledge, the purpose of SNG, as currently proposed, is to examine or determine whether the ethnic marriage that led to Nigeria nation is okay; whether the terms of the marriage should be re-negotiated and whether ethnic nationalities are the preferred options. Tell me if I am WRONG! To many of us on this aisle, such a discussion a NEGATIVE emphasis on the differences people have, WHICH WILL not be productive; rather, we have CONSISTENTLY advocated the following: 1. Build on the acquaintance and the common bonds Nigeria ethnic groups have developed over these years by electing capable leaders across ethnic lines; 2. Nigerians of the ethnic groups should exercise the courage to call their corrupt and inept leaders to shape up, sit up and perform for their communities and Nigeria, and QUIT shifting blames to Nigerian formation formula. Nigeria will be as progressive as the management capabilities of the representatives of the different ethnic groups who discuss and manage her affairs; it is irresponsible to shift the blame to the nation formulation; the quality of a final product is as good as the quality of the composite parts. In summary, as Madam Secretary of State Hilary Clinton, rightly advised, Nigerians MUST QUIT the clamors to discuss their DIFFERENCES as the important national issues; Nigerians MUST commit to and focus on Nation Building (COMMON HUMANITY/DESTINY), to be considered adequately fit and sufficiently equipped to march alongside other modern nations towards the imminent Global Village! Take care. JUI From: NaijaObserver@yahoogroups.com [mailto:NaijaObserver@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of idowu My Dear Opubo: I agree with you, the problem with most of these people is that, they've never visited the Niger Delta area to see the ecological destruction by the oil exploration. To know that a Buguma or Abonema man who buys a car, would have put the car on a barge to take home for his parents to view (a distance not up to Lagos Mainland bridge length). "It is almost impossible for a nation to rise past a certain point if the constituent groups within the nation believe their differences are more important than their common humanity and common destiny."-Hillary Clinton on Nigeria (2009). To some people like JUI, the current Nigeria situation is their Eldorado. But they forgot that no one have any regard, for a brain that refuses to explore. Idowu "There may be times when we are powerless to prevent injustice, but there must never be a time when we fail to protest." -- Elie Wiesel From: Alabo Opubo <alaboopubo@gbanalysts.com> Idowu, my friend, Look there is nothing you guys have written this past many days that I have not written from last year through early this year. All I got was abuses just as you have been subjected to until I fired in return. Everything you guys have written about I have written about, so much so that Val Ojo got tired of the exchange and got involved before the endless meaningless exchange stopped - that was last year. So when you got into this exchange I knew that it was not going to get anywhere and will certainly end up in name calling and what have you. Spewing invectives is a common practice, when one stands his own ground of argument. I have simply moved off from any exchanges of the likes so that I do not have to spend my time abusing, insulting and name-calling. I simply stay away from certain discussions. the irony of it all is that some of these people do not even realize that they are being abusive - it just does not register in their value system that they are being abusive.Even more so they think that one should let be unidirectional: So long as they are doing the abuses it is okay, but as soon as you return the fire they complain about having being abused and called names: Of yours they are cognizant, but of theirs they are not. Most strange. Any way I am glad you have come to the same realization of exchanges with some of these forumites as I have. In fact only recently I was eliciting the situation to Mike Asu. Regards, Opubo G Benebo There is no earthly hope for a man who is too lazy to acquire enemies [be forthright and you will acquire enemies, be truthful and you will acquire enemies] -- a Noble Canadian.
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