Adeshina;
That point has been addressed. Anyone boasting so many degrees and comes up to stand behind not reading a book before doing an exegesis on it, deserves to have his degrees stripped off him.
A lot of people came up on these listservs to criticize Achebe's book without ever having opened a page of the document. They were here the whole time, asserting their rights to critique a book they have not read. So, what does that make of the educational qualifications we lay claims to?
That is the point that should be occupying you. What do we hand down to future generations, when we come here to defend a mindset that is prejudicial to critical and factual reflection on issues.
That is the point being made.
Franklyne Ogbunwezeh
* ************** *************** ****************** *************** ***********
What constitutes a disservice to our faculty of judgment, however, is to place obstacles in the way of assembling truth's fragments, remaining content with a mere one- or two-dimensional projection where a multidimensional and multifaceted apprehension remains open, accessible and instructive.
What constitutes a disservice to our faculty of judgment, however, is to place obstacles in the way of assembling truth's fragments, remaining content with a mere one- or two-dimensional projection where a multidimensional and multifaceted apprehension remains open, accessible and instructive.
Wole Soyinka, Between Truth and Indulgences
From: "shina73_1999@yahoo.com" <shina73_1999@yahoo.com>
To: usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com
Sent: Monday, October 29, 2012 12:52 PM
Subject: Re: USA Africa Dialogue Series - On Achebe's There Was A Country.
Chidi,
I also felt so bad about the new (well, not so new) turn of event on the forum. What is the whole point about a person's masters and phd in the context of his argument? Is the insinuation that since he is still getting degrees, he can't argue properly or what? If there is a classic ad hominem fallacy, this is it. It will serve a good purpose in my logic class.
And, if I may ask, does his many programmes detract from the force of his arguments? "Lack of intellectual depth"? Oh my God! How do you measure that if you fail to confront the other person's arguments? It is one thing to hate a person, it is another to respect his arguments. If an argument is absurd, it is still an argument and all you need to do is to point out its absurdity; rather than raising fallacious issues. So, if people can go to the extent to exhuming a person's academic personal issues to counter his arguments, something is critically wrong somewhere. I suspect the stink is really coming from their own backyard.
We shouldn't get to this level of mudslinging. It detracts from the seriousness and joviality of this great forum.
Adeshina Afolayan
Sent from my BlackBerry wireless device from MTN
-----Original Message-----
From: Chidi Anthony Opara <chidi.opara@gmail.com>
Sender: usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com
Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 02:39:50
To: USA Africa Dialogue Series<usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com>
Reply-To: usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: USA Africa Dialogue Series - On Achebe's There Was A Country.
That a man with two masters' degrees and a Ph.d disagreed and such
disagreement appears absurd does not in any way invalidate his
degrees. Degrees or not, a man can disagree, even absurdly, sometimes
because of genuine conviction and sometimes because of other
considerations. As for the Poet, he lies whenever the issue is
connected to Awolowo and that is because he is always under pressure
to lie in such situations.
---CAO.
On Oct 29, 8:18 am, "Dr. Emmanuel Franklyne Ogbunwezeh"
<ogbunwe...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Dr. Agonizo:
>
> That was a great brotherly reprimand of our illustrious Ikhide. Lol! I wonder why you guys Pay attention to someone. Who is so very stepped in prejudices that he is so Allergic to the rigours of scholarship. Although this noisemaker spent his Time acquiring three Masters degree and One phd, his his lack of intellectual depth is frightening. Even a Medico-biological personality of Nigeria extraction confessed to the Same allergies towards reading in these forums. That was when I truly believed that Nigeria is a forgone conclusion. In fact, in only a few years to come, another "there was a Country" is bound to be written. This Time, that past Tense will apply to Nigeria.
>
> Dr. Franklyne Emmanuel Ogbunwezeh
>
> Am 29.10.2012 um 01:57 schrieb Biko Agozino <bikoz...@yahoo.com>:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > Bro Ikhide,
>
> > Glad to hear that you finally found time to start reading the book, you rascal. Some books just grab your attention and make you drop everything else to read it before opening your mouth to yab, as you said.
>
> > Never say again that you will not find the time to read a book like There Was A Country, you are setting a bad example to those who have all the time to give lengthy interviews and excavate what Soyinka called 'erudite irrelevancies' in Season of Anomy as elaborate excuses for not reading anything, never mind a hotly discussed instant classic like Achebe's. You also set a bad example by abandoning your son's soccer match to go and sit in your car when you should be there at the touchline, cheering the future Super Eagle with ohh, ohh, ohh! Make sure you apologize to the boy o!
>
> > Instead of plugging your Kindle to show off how hip and cool you are, you should make time to read that book in detail for we all await your detailed review. A Poet also lied that he glanced at a copy on his friends Kindle but that he was yet to read the book himself. And yet he had no hesitation to compete for attention by stating that he was a juvenile reporter back then and so he supposedly knows it all; and that, in any case, the most important book on Nigerian history was already written by a certain Mr Greene (Bekee bu Agbara or the Whiteman is an Oracle, as the Igbo would say) and so there is no need to read anything that Achebe has to say about events in which he was a major participant observer. The Poet Lied indeed.
>
> > To joke that you will have no time to read Achebe's book is to give encouragement to folks like a certain postgraduate student in London who said that he thinks that professors are slaves because they have no control over their time (completely ignorant of how free professors are with their time as members of the Petty Bourgeoisie) and thinks that he is more sophisticated than professors because he is taking his time to complete three Master's degrees and a Ph.D. at the same time to enable him to be an employer of labor. He too had no time to read Achebe but is poking around to find documents to support his prejudice that the great author is a villain and not a hero (rather than buckling down to concentrate on his endless dissertation as he was wisely advised on several occasions). How anti-intellectual, mean and vindictive have our people become?
>
> > You are right that ignorant Nigerians are not to blame when our educational system is in shambles but how about Nigerians being educated abroad who are steeped in all sorts of irrationality? We all must strive to show better examples: Do not give the impression that a book as important as There Was A Country is competing for attention with your kid's soccer match of no more than 90 minutes. Demonstrate better time-management for the young by mapping out the solid block of time when you will not be able to put down the book as you confessed when the text took hold of you and refused to let go. As you said, you could not put it down. What did you expect? Enjoy and share more of your thoughts.
>
> > Biko
>
> > --- On Sun, 28/10/12, Ikhide <xoki...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > From: Ikhide <xoki...@yahoo.com>
> > Subject: USA Africa Dialogue Series - On Achebe's There Was A Country.
> > To: "Ederi" <Ed...@yahoogroups.com>, "Toyin Falola" <USAAfricaDialogue@googlegroups.com>
> > Date: Sunday, 28 October, 2012, 14:53
>
> > I had said elsewhere I would not have the time to read Chinua Achebe's new book, There Was A Country. I have a backlog of many books and manuscripts that I am determined to finish before taking on anything new. And besides, as an amateur student of the Nigerian civil war, and a child caught up in the war (the Biafran occupation of Benin City) I was not sure what I was going to learn new there. Yesterday however as I sat in my car waiting for my son's football game to end, I turned on my kindle app and it was there.
>
> > Reading it clearly makes the profoundly sad point that many who have "reviewed" the book dispensed with the inconvenience of reading it. It is a sad commentary on how we conduct the business of scholarship these days. Many people should be stripped of their degrees, they are a disgrace to scholarship.
>
> > There are many things to disagree with Achebe about, but one comes away with a sad realization that we are witnessing the passing of an era, of principled hard working writers and thinkers, well educated and brought up to believe in intellectual rigor. Please go and read that book before you open your mouths one more time. The man puts together a compilation of sources including our own Professor Toyin Falola in order to tell a moving compelling story about his life. And yes, it is not all about Biafra. There are powerful passages there for instance about the burden of the writer of African extraction, profoundly moving are his thoughts on what we should be preoccupied with.
>
> > It is a great look back, one that should elicit a more coherent and respectful engagement than what we are currently witnessing. To be fair, our educational system is at best incoherent, in reality in shambles. People are reacting with pieces of dog-eared junk because we have not invested in an infrastructure that keeps our history intact. It is our loss, not Achebe's.
>
> > I would like to put this book down, but I can't because I am simply in awe at the grace and courage of this man who was born into many wars that he did not ask for.
>
> > - Ikhide
>
> > - Ikhide
>
> > Stalk my blog athttp://www.xokigbo.com/
> > Follow me on Twitter: @ikhide
> > Join me on Facebook:www.facebook.com/ikhide
>
> > --
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the "USA-Africa Dialogue Series" moderated by Toyin Falola, University of Texas at Austin.
> > For current archives, visithttp://groups.google.com/group/USAAfricaDialogue
> > For previous archives, visithttp://www.utexas.edu/conferences/africa/ads/index.html
> > To post to this group, send an email to USAAfricaDialogue@googlegroups.com
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to USAAfricaDialogue-
> > unsubscribe@googlegroups.com
>
> > --
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the "USA-Africa Dialogue Series" moderated by Toyin Falola, University of Texas at Austin.
> > For current archives, visithttp://groups.google.com/group/USAAfricaDialogue
> > For previous archives, visithttp://www.utexas.edu/conferences/africa/ads/index.html
> > To post to this group, send an email to USAAfricaDialogue@googlegroups.com
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to USAAfricaDialogue-
> > unsubscribe@googlegroups.com
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--
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For previous archives, visit http://www.utexas.edu/conferences/africa/ads/index.html
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From: "shina73_1999@yahoo.com" <shina73_1999@yahoo.com>
To: usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com
Sent: Monday, October 29, 2012 12:52 PM
Subject: Re: USA Africa Dialogue Series - On Achebe's There Was A Country.
Chidi,
I also felt so bad about the new (well, not so new) turn of event on the forum. What is the whole point about a person's masters and phd in the context of his argument? Is the insinuation that since he is still getting degrees, he can't argue properly or what? If there is a classic ad hominem fallacy, this is it. It will serve a good purpose in my logic class.
And, if I may ask, does his many programmes detract from the force of his arguments? "Lack of intellectual depth"? Oh my God! How do you measure that if you fail to confront the other person's arguments? It is one thing to hate a person, it is another to respect his arguments. If an argument is absurd, it is still an argument and all you need to do is to point out its absurdity; rather than raising fallacious issues. So, if people can go to the extent to exhuming a person's academic personal issues to counter his arguments, something is critically wrong somewhere. I suspect the stink is really coming from their own backyard.
We shouldn't get to this level of mudslinging. It detracts from the seriousness and joviality of this great forum.
Adeshina Afolayan
Sent from my BlackBerry wireless device from MTN
-----Original Message-----
From: Chidi Anthony Opara <chidi.opara@gmail.com>
Sender: usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com
Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 02:39:50
To: USA Africa Dialogue Series<usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com>
Reply-To: usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: USA Africa Dialogue Series - On Achebe's There Was A Country.
That a man with two masters' degrees and a Ph.d disagreed and such
disagreement appears absurd does not in any way invalidate his
degrees. Degrees or not, a man can disagree, even absurdly, sometimes
because of genuine conviction and sometimes because of other
considerations. As for the Poet, he lies whenever the issue is
connected to Awolowo and that is because he is always under pressure
to lie in such situations.
---CAO.
On Oct 29, 8:18 am, "Dr. Emmanuel Franklyne Ogbunwezeh"
<ogbunwe...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Dr. Agonizo:
>
> That was a great brotherly reprimand of our illustrious Ikhide. Lol! I wonder why you guys Pay attention to someone. Who is so very stepped in prejudices that he is so Allergic to the rigours of scholarship. Although this noisemaker spent his Time acquiring three Masters degree and One phd, his his lack of intellectual depth is frightening. Even a Medico-biological personality of Nigeria extraction confessed to the Same allergies towards reading in these forums. That was when I truly believed that Nigeria is a forgone conclusion. In fact, in only a few years to come, another "there was a Country" is bound to be written. This Time, that past Tense will apply to Nigeria.
>
> Dr. Franklyne Emmanuel Ogbunwezeh
>
> Am 29.10.2012 um 01:57 schrieb Biko Agozino <bikoz...@yahoo.com>:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > Bro Ikhide,
>
> > Glad to hear that you finally found time to start reading the book, you rascal. Some books just grab your attention and make you drop everything else to read it before opening your mouth to yab, as you said.
>
> > Never say again that you will not find the time to read a book like There Was A Country, you are setting a bad example to those who have all the time to give lengthy interviews and excavate what Soyinka called 'erudite irrelevancies' in Season of Anomy as elaborate excuses for not reading anything, never mind a hotly discussed instant classic like Achebe's. You also set a bad example by abandoning your son's soccer match to go and sit in your car when you should be there at the touchline, cheering the future Super Eagle with ohh, ohh, ohh! Make sure you apologize to the boy o!
>
> > Instead of plugging your Kindle to show off how hip and cool you are, you should make time to read that book in detail for we all await your detailed review. A Poet also lied that he glanced at a copy on his friends Kindle but that he was yet to read the book himself. And yet he had no hesitation to compete for attention by stating that he was a juvenile reporter back then and so he supposedly knows it all; and that, in any case, the most important book on Nigerian history was already written by a certain Mr Greene (Bekee bu Agbara or the Whiteman is an Oracle, as the Igbo would say) and so there is no need to read anything that Achebe has to say about events in which he was a major participant observer. The Poet Lied indeed.
>
> > To joke that you will have no time to read Achebe's book is to give encouragement to folks like a certain postgraduate student in London who said that he thinks that professors are slaves because they have no control over their time (completely ignorant of how free professors are with their time as members of the Petty Bourgeoisie) and thinks that he is more sophisticated than professors because he is taking his time to complete three Master's degrees and a Ph.D. at the same time to enable him to be an employer of labor. He too had no time to read Achebe but is poking around to find documents to support his prejudice that the great author is a villain and not a hero (rather than buckling down to concentrate on his endless dissertation as he was wisely advised on several occasions). How anti-intellectual, mean and vindictive have our people become?
>
> > You are right that ignorant Nigerians are not to blame when our educational system is in shambles but how about Nigerians being educated abroad who are steeped in all sorts of irrationality? We all must strive to show better examples: Do not give the impression that a book as important as There Was A Country is competing for attention with your kid's soccer match of no more than 90 minutes. Demonstrate better time-management for the young by mapping out the solid block of time when you will not be able to put down the book as you confessed when the text took hold of you and refused to let go. As you said, you could not put it down. What did you expect? Enjoy and share more of your thoughts.
>
> > Biko
>
> > --- On Sun, 28/10/12, Ikhide <xoki...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > From: Ikhide <xoki...@yahoo.com>
> > Subject: USA Africa Dialogue Series - On Achebe's There Was A Country.
> > To: "Ederi" <Ed...@yahoogroups.com>, "Toyin Falola" <USAAfricaDialogue@googlegroups.com>
> > Date: Sunday, 28 October, 2012, 14:53
>
> > I had said elsewhere I would not have the time to read Chinua Achebe's new book, There Was A Country. I have a backlog of many books and manuscripts that I am determined to finish before taking on anything new. And besides, as an amateur student of the Nigerian civil war, and a child caught up in the war (the Biafran occupation of Benin City) I was not sure what I was going to learn new there. Yesterday however as I sat in my car waiting for my son's football game to end, I turned on my kindle app and it was there.
>
> > Reading it clearly makes the profoundly sad point that many who have "reviewed" the book dispensed with the inconvenience of reading it. It is a sad commentary on how we conduct the business of scholarship these days. Many people should be stripped of their degrees, they are a disgrace to scholarship.
>
> > There are many things to disagree with Achebe about, but one comes away with a sad realization that we are witnessing the passing of an era, of principled hard working writers and thinkers, well educated and brought up to believe in intellectual rigor. Please go and read that book before you open your mouths one more time. The man puts together a compilation of sources including our own Professor Toyin Falola in order to tell a moving compelling story about his life. And yes, it is not all about Biafra. There are powerful passages there for instance about the burden of the writer of African extraction, profoundly moving are his thoughts on what we should be preoccupied with.
>
> > It is a great look back, one that should elicit a more coherent and respectful engagement than what we are currently witnessing. To be fair, our educational system is at best incoherent, in reality in shambles. People are reacting with pieces of dog-eared junk because we have not invested in an infrastructure that keeps our history intact. It is our loss, not Achebe's.
>
> > I would like to put this book down, but I can't because I am simply in awe at the grace and courage of this man who was born into many wars that he did not ask for.
>
> > - Ikhide
>
> > - Ikhide
>
> > Stalk my blog athttp://www.xokigbo.com/
> > Follow me on Twitter: @ikhide
> > Join me on Facebook:www.facebook.com/ikhide
>
> > --
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the "USA-Africa Dialogue Series" moderated by Toyin Falola, University of Texas at Austin.
> > For current archives, visithttp://groups.google.com/group/USAAfricaDialogue
> > For previous archives, visithttp://www.utexas.edu/conferences/africa/ads/index.html
> > To post to this group, send an email to USAAfricaDialogue@googlegroups.com
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to USAAfricaDialogue-
> > unsubscribe@googlegroups.com
>
> > --
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the "USA-Africa Dialogue Series" moderated by Toyin Falola, University of Texas at Austin.
> > For current archives, visithttp://groups.google.com/group/USAAfricaDialogue
> > For previous archives, visithttp://www.utexas.edu/conferences/africa/ads/index.html
> > To post to this group, send an email to USAAfricaDialogue@googlegroups.com
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to USAAfricaDialogue-
> > unsubscribe@googlegroups.com
--
--
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For current archives, visit http://groups.google.com/group/USAAfricaDialogue
For previous archives, visit http://www.utexas.edu/conferences/africa/ads/index.html
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