Re: USA Africa Dialogue Series - Cheikh Anta Diop

Thank you very much, Jaye.

I would like to understand the difference between " 'scientific Pan- Africanists' " as opposed to "utopian pan africanism [of] the late 80s and early 90s!"

Can you sum it up?

On your point about Egypt, but the African-Americans have eagerly embraced ancient Egypt ad even modern Egypt defines its tourist image in terms of ancient Egypt.

Even more striking, at the heart of the history of the body of knowledge represented by Western esotericism is the undisputed and openly visible influence of Egypt. 

Central to Western esotericism is the work of Hermes Trismesgistus, whose ideas seem traceable ultimately to Egypt. Hermeticism is very significant too for the work of Isaac Newton as evident from even a casual glance at modern Newton scholarship.

Also, at the heart of the most influential magical school in the modern Western history, The Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn, is a fantastic reworking of ancient Egyptian ritual and cosmology, an approach taken forward magnificently by Aleister Crowley, one of the most significant religious figures of the 20th century, in my view. 

Yet, Africans do not seem to take to heart the iconic Egyptian Book of the Dead, Akhnaton, the famous revolutionary pharaoh, the awesome   Egyptian architecture,which the Western esoteric Rosicrucian school of AMORC uses as its central architectural  style at its US headquarters  or to the the art of Egypt,  whether  in scholarship, the arts or even on platforms like Facebook, while Diaspora Africans are using ancient Egypt as a centre  of identification, along with the Yoruba origin Orisa tradition and Voodoo, as in this superb voodoo group-Supreme Voudun-African Cosmology-Hathor Centre for Massive Metaphysical Research ( note that Hathor is an Egyptian deity) and the mother site Supreme-Voudun and the wonderful Facebook page Ayibobo Nan Ginsen M'soti .

Ayi Kwei Armah did publish Osiris Rising but I wonder if African writers and artists  show much, if any interest in Egypt.

I am also curious as to why Egypt's advanced civilisation does not seem to have influenced other African civilisations.

I understand there are small pyramids in the Sudan. What could the significance of that be? 

I am puzzled as to why writing was not developed to greater level in Africa, beyond Egypt and Ethiopian Geetz script  if I am correct, in spite of the achievement of Egypt  

Was if the difficulty of crossing beyond Northern Africa?

I would like to share some fantastic Facebook images that indicate this fascination with Egypt in the African Diaspora-

toyin

On Sat, Dec 29, 2012 at 7:34 PM, Jaye Gaskia <ogbegbe@yahoo.com> wrote:

Toyin,

I am responding as myself, and not on behalf of Cornelius to whom you addressed your questions. I have read Diop, and i am a little familiar with him. Encountering him and his body of works was one of those moments that turned us into what we then called 'scientific Pan- Africanists' as opposed to what we saw as utopian pan africanism in the late 80s and early 90s!

However that is not the point of my response, the point of my response is on the bit about the relevance of Egypt to Africans. I get the impression that the very different character of ancient Egypt in contrast to its present Arab character maybe part of that reason. And it was to the unravelling of this dichotomy that Diop partly devoted his life and work!

Warm Regards,

Jaye

From: OLUWATOYIN ADEPOJU <tvade3@gmail.com>
To: usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com
Sent: Saturday, December 29, 2012 7:42 PM
Subject: Re: USA Africa Dialogue Series - Cheikh Anta Diop

Cornelius,

Have you read Diop?

What do you think of him?

I have not read him yet. 

He is much lionised by Africa centred thinkers but he does not seem to feature much in the little exposure I have had to readings in African history.

I was struck to see a description in the Fitzwilliam Museum in Cambridge of the ancient Egyptians as Black. I did not know that idea had gained the level of acceptance reflected in such a museum.

In all, though, I get the impression that Egypt has little significance  for many Africans and that its significance is much stronger for Diaspora Africans.

What do you think?

toyin

On Sat, Dec 29, 2012 at 6:29 PM, Cornelius Hamelberg <corneliushamelberg@gmail.com> wrote:

Today is Cheikh Anta Diop's birthday  - some of the Diopists have been
celebrating that in Stockholm!

https://www.google.co.uk/#hl=en&sugexp=les%3B&gs_rn=1&gs_ri=hp&tok=ILstxByuwc-SlnwPzA8Tzw&cp=16&gs_id=9z&xhr=t&q=Cheikh+Anta+Diop&pf=p&tbo=d&output=search&sclient=psy-ab&oq=Cheikh+Anta+Diop&gs_l=&pbx=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_cp.r_qf.&bvm=bv.1355534169,d.bGE&fp=fc7fe2b45ce62c75&bpcl=40096503&biw=1024&bih=614

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