USA Africa Dialogue Series - Re: The Smoke That Must Be White

"I don't know if you are an apostle of Chineke or a Catholic……….."
-------Mazi Cornelius.

Mazi,
If you had taken time to discuss faith with adherents of Igbo
traditional religion the way I think you did with Igbo Christians when
you were enjoying roasted yam with palm oil and fresh palm wine(and
maybe other things) in Igboland in the 1970s and 1980s, you would have
found out that there is no difference between the messages of Jesus
Christ and the injunctions of Chineke (God the creator). The
difference (and sometimes the problem) lies in how the messages/
injunctions are received and interpreted.

My interest in the Papacy is however, purely political. The Papacy,
with the huge political influence it commands, cannot be ignored by
any serious person, religious leaning notwithstanding.

Ndewo.

CAO,


On 2 Mar, 10:42, Cornelius Hamelberg <corneliushamelb...@gmail.com>
wrote:
> Chidi,
>
> Indeed, one man's meat is another man's poison.
>
> Of course Holy Wood  had a black man play the role of Judas  - and
> that's an image that must have got stuck on the popular imagination. I
> hope that you have seen soul brother Carl Anderson's excellent
> depiction of Judas in the movie musical  "Jesus Christ Super star":
>
> http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Carl+Anderson+as+Judas+&o...
>
> You are being subjective, objective, whatever.
>
> I am not qualified to judge the Conclave as a whole.
> In Matthew 7 the still not crucified Jewish Jesus, advises about
> making judgements:
>
> http://www.google.co.uk/#hl=en&biw=1024&bih=610&sclient=psy-ab&q=+Mat...
>
> I am not talking about the flesh,blood and bone reality of whoever
> occupies the papacy or your reality and that's why broadly speaking
> and in the name of vagueness and generality I named it reality  - not
> my reality or Hallaj's "anal haq" or the colour and texture or DNA of
> his skin or his genetic ancestry. In the case of Jesus, according to
> the genealogy presented in the Gospel according to St. Matthew (his
> reality) Jesus was descended through King David whose grandmother Ruth
> was a convert to the Hebrew Faith – and there too is a paradox (of
> movement) that you are free to dilate on, that Jesus was born in
> Bethlehem which is still a little town in Israel, that most probably
> he and his twelve  disciples too were circumcised on the eighth day,
> that he visited the Temple, is said to have been aware of the
> importance of keeping the Commandments (613 of them) as evidenced in
> what he is reported to have said to the rich young man who like him is
> commanded by the Almighty to be holy  - the additional difference  -
> an innovation by the Lord of the Last Supper, to wit, Jesus saying,
> "But if it's perfection that you want, then go, sell your possessions
> and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come,
> follow me."  (Matthew 19:21)
>
> As you yourself mentioned in one of your pithy observations, "While we
> were being taught in the Roman Catholic Church children's Sunday
> schools in the 1970s that it would be like the head of a camel passing
> through the eye of a needle for a wealthy person to enter heaven, the
> same Roman Catholic Church through the Vatican bank was busy acquiring
> wealth."
>
> http://groups.google.com/group/usaafricadialogue/msg/740b7a934b8ca10a
>
> About the black or white smoke that will come billowing out of the
> select Vatican chimney, there are several factors at play among the
> 115 personalities that comprise the conclave. Did I say 115
> personalities? Well, most importantly, among the 115  Cardinals who
> are the electoral executives of the Papacy, so to speak, there's also
> the third person of the Roman Catholic Church's so called
> "Holy Trinity"  and according to Catholic doctrine, praxis and
> belief , it is HE that will guide the conclave in deciding who the
> next Pope will be.
>
> You have heard about the Borgias?
>
> http://www.google.co.uk/#hl=en&output=search&sclient=psy-ab&q=The+Bor...
>
> So there are always other commonplace realities that exist on the
> ground and I'm sure that there are complex realities and perhaps even
> political tensions between Cardinals representing their various
> constituencies, peoples and tendencies in the body politic known as
> the Conclave – and of course all kinds of  human expectations in far
> away places, outside of that conclave – in some of these places colour
> of skin is a spiritual quality (and perhaps a political definition
> too). Kwame Anthony Appiah deals with that in one of his earliest
> books, " In My Father' House"  - you know the rest of the Jesus
> saying,"In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I
> would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you." In a nutshell
> thought in and of itself is not "racial" it can emanate from any
> geographic location/ environment  - it can even propagate or reflect
> self interest ...
>
> http://www.google.co.uk/#hl=en&sclient=psy-ab&q=Kwame+Anthony+Appiah+...
>
> So Chidi, as far as the politicization of  the appointment of the new
> pope of the spiritual and temporal organisation known in history as
> the very powerful Roman Catholic church is concerned,
>  I don't know if you  are an apostle of Chineke or a Catholic or not
> or if it's true that you didn't attend a Catholic school but
> nonetheless were an alter boy like Sheikh Abdul or studied Latin,
> Greek philosophy and Christian doctrine with some revered Cardinals or
> Bishops in Rome which is in Italy, but whatever or wherever you are in
> the watery presence, this is a time to have faith in the workings of
> the Holy Spirit  - even if your limited human understanding and
> expectations will be disappointed. I do not pray for the Judas-i-
> zation of the Papacy or that anti-Semitism or the desire to convert
> all the Jewish people to Roman Catholicism should be a quality that
> should qualify the papal candidates for the Papacy.
>
> I remain your good friend,
>
> http://www.thelocal.se/blogs/corneliushamelberg/
>
> And here's a song about the way it is....
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pgs76Fq3lEk
>
> On Mar 2, 11:16 am, Chidi Anthony Opara <chidi.op...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > "Cheer up Chidi and face reality!"
> > --------Mazi Cornelius.
>
> > Mazi,
> > What is the reality?
> > Why should your reality be the reality?
> > Why should I always face your reality?
> > Is my own reality not important?
> > Can't we face my own reality for a change?
>
> > CAO.
>
> > On 1 Mar, 06:09, Cornelius Hamelberg <corneliushamelb...@gmail.com>
> > wrote:
>
> > > Cheer up Chidi!
>
> > > Who is best qualified to lead the Caholic Church here on earth ?
>
> > > I intuit that you would like to see a Black Pope (Black Power in the
> > > Holy Roman Catholic Church ) and perhaps, preferably some black smoke
> > > curling out of the chimney, signalling his election or beatification?
>
> > > You and your Afri-kan-ists kan still hope, but from the beginning I
> > > have seriously doubted that the homophobic Islamophobe Turkson will
> > > get it. The head of the Holy Roman Empire versus the Chief Mufti of
> > > the Islamic Caliphate? We don't want a repeat of the Crusades. World
> > > peace demands a Pope who will maintain good diplomatic relations with
> > > the adherents of Prophet Isa (Jesus) albeit with the difference that
> > > they do not believe in  Christianity's  foundation that he expired on
> > > the cross.
>
> > > Yesterday, I saw them all (the cardinals ) lined up in order of
> > > seniority, shaking hands with His Holiness (on TV) and each of them
> > > having a brief personal word with him, strained my ears to hear what
> > > they had to say (long distance revolutionary eavesdropping) but they
> > > were too far away.
>
> > > You can be sure of one thing dear Chidi: the Holy Spirit is
> > > Discernment itself and does not discriminate on a colour basis. So why
> > > all this fascination with White ?
>
> > > Remember Chinweizu's unholy ( petty) critique of Wole Soyinka's poem
> > > "To my first white hairs "?
>
> > >http://www.google.co.uk/#hl=en&sclient=psy-ab&q=Chinweizu%27s+critiqu...
>
> > > An improbable rationale for expecting some revolutionary Black smoke
> > > like some fire in Soweto making more black clouds in the sky.
>
> > > Cheer up Chidi and face reality!
>
> > > Sincerely,
>
> > >http://www.thelocal.se/blogs/corneliushamelberg/
>
> > > On Mar 1, 9:15 am, ChidiAnthonyOparaPoetry/Quotes
>
> > > <chidianthonyoparapoe...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > > > (Poem By: Chidi Anthony Opara)
>
> > > > Shhh.
> > > > Silence.
> > > > The red robed supplicants
> > > > Are sequestered
> > > > Inside the Sistine.
>
> > > > They speak
> > > > In silent supplications
> > > > To the spirits
> > > > To pronounce a Pontiff.
>
> > > > The stewards are set
> > > > To send the smoke.
> > > > The smoke
> > > > That must be white.
>
> > > > Reproductions in part or in whole, in whatever forms, of ChidiAnthonyOparaPoetry/Quotes except for non-profit information and education purposes, without a written permission from PublicInformationProjects is not allowed.

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