Human beings will always have their differences. Is it not time human suffering, misery, loss, avoidable deaths, and war, made human beings wiser. Has anyone taken stock of the colossal waste (lies, money, personal freedom, mutual respect, and trust among others), that the global war against domestic and international terrorism has entailed. The human race has not had more knowledge than it has now? Should the present state of knowledge not make more positive and less negative difference than seems to be the case? Does it not matter that it is the 21st century and not the 1st century? Why is accommodation and tolerance of difference so difficult for so many human beings to live with? What the world needs now may be a global war on intolerance.
From: usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com [usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of kenneth harrow [harrow@msu.edu]
Sent: Sunday, July 28, 2013 1:52 PM
To: usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: USA Africa Dialogue Series - Re: Nigeria: Boko Haram, poverty, Jonathan and the game of musical chairs
it is true that the scriptures of judaism, christianity, and islam celebrate brutal acts of killing, and ancient notions of justice that are also brutal. but if you really care to read the bhagavad gita or scriptures of other religions, you'll find equally brutal acts described
it is a naive, superficial, childish reading that takes any of these scriptures literally. the same goes for ifa or african religious representations or tales or sayings.
none of these really convey the religion, only the surface. where is the religion, then? in the commentaries that follow the original texts, in the interpretations generated over the centuries, in the readings, in the thinking, in the reflexions, in the revisions of those commentaries, over and over and over, with more and more subtleties and layers of implications growing
has anyone on this list taught something like sundiata? a literal reading is worthless; an interpretation is a beginning of its wisdom.
religion is only a pillar on which humans hang their beliefs; at times their rationalizations for horrible acts of domination or notions of superiority; at times their nobler impulses, their grace and love and beauty. it is all there, my friend, if you study it carefully and painstakingly.
if not, it isn't worth the bother.
after all, what is it that the old man sees, sitting down, that the youngster can't see standing on top of the world trade center? it isn't the obvious, the nose on your face; it is the thing you can't quite see, the thing you see when you start talking to the other guy next to you, to the others who have been studying that thing out there on the horizon all their lives, and are wondering about it....
abolish religions, that won't make any difference. all old men and women can tell you that
ken
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it is a naive, superficial, childish reading that takes any of these scriptures literally. the same goes for ifa or african religious representations or tales or sayings.
none of these really convey the religion, only the surface. where is the religion, then? in the commentaries that follow the original texts, in the interpretations generated over the centuries, in the readings, in the thinking, in the reflexions, in the revisions of those commentaries, over and over and over, with more and more subtleties and layers of implications growing
has anyone on this list taught something like sundiata? a literal reading is worthless; an interpretation is a beginning of its wisdom.
religion is only a pillar on which humans hang their beliefs; at times their rationalizations for horrible acts of domination or notions of superiority; at times their nobler impulses, their grace and love and beauty. it is all there, my friend, if you study it carefully and painstakingly.
if not, it isn't worth the bother.
after all, what is it that the old man sees, sitting down, that the youngster can't see standing on top of the world trade center? it isn't the obvious, the nose on your face; it is the thing you can't quite see, the thing you see when you start talking to the other guy next to you, to the others who have been studying that thing out there on the horizon all their lives, and are wondering about it....
abolish religions, that won't make any difference. all old men and women can tell you that
ken
On 7/28/13 6:24 PM, Oyinlola Longe wrote:
I applaud your objectivity Blargeo. Howe'er its difficult not to become sentimental about these issues. These sentiments emanate from love, pain, helplessness and hope. We are not as sophisticated as we think, especially when terror gets too close for comfort, and you cannot be thankful that none of yours is affected because of those whose loved ones have been killed. Maybe its time to blame our helplessness regarding situations we are all responsible for as humans one way or the other.
On 28 Jul 2013 14:41, <blargeo.dekeye@gmail.com> wrote:--
Dear Ola and all,
I am almost innure to the frenzied (foaming at the mouth) passion provoked by religion and any attempt at or dicussions on religious issues; but nobody not even the dead are spared from landslides.
Without equivocation, Christianity like Islam and Judaism are killer religions. Their scriptures are filled with divinely sanctioned genocides, human sacrifice, cruelty to children, women and other races.
If Islam has trumped the other two in the scale of killings in recent times it is because the west was recently able to separate religion from the state (to a large extent). The blood thirst of the theocracy in the Arab world is rivalled only by the christian dark ages and its biblery popery.
Nothing in this world, apart from nationalism, takes men back to the hobbessian state than the 3 Abramaic religions. Thus it is condescending to hear a Jew or christian say "I have met good moslems, civil moslems or refined moslems". Most adherents of these faiths are first adherents by birth, conviction comes
later after years of indoctrination and being force fed the story of dysfunctional Hebrew people and their gods.
I think the only people who can objectively engage religion without wishing cyber burning at the stake or ibombing on fellow contributors are those whose minds have been fed and constantly nourished by broad literature. Those who believe in the fairy tale of winged horses and virgin conceptions; a pimp gods who organises virgins (obviously underraged) and rapture should be feared equally. There is no telling what they can do for their god!
Happily I am a lapsed christian and none the worse for it.
Blargeo
... And that is all she wrote!
Sent from my BlackBerry wireless device from MTN
________________________________From: olakassimmd@aol.comDate: Sun, 28 Jul 2013 00:55:18 -0400 (EDT)ReplyTo: usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.comSubject: USA Africa Dialogue Series - Re: Nigeria: Boko Haram, poverty, Jonathan and the game of musical chairs
Mr Segun Ogungbemi:
A decent and moral human being would readily admit his or her
error of judg...
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-- kenneth w. harrow faculty excellence advocate distinguished professor of english michigan state university department of english 619 red cedar road room C-614 wells hall east lansing, mi 48824 ph. 517 803 8839 harrow@msu.edu--
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