Friday, October 9, 2015

Re: USA Africa Dialogue Series - Breaking..Fulani kidnap Yoruba Oba [Unfolding Crisis in Nigeria]

Ugo,

I guess there is no accountability for what we say, then, as we can suddenly become too busy or respond with silence, in the hope that silence would confer a dignity that is already lost to reckless speech. Taking back misplaced comments can redeem a measure of decency, though.  But I will let this go.

Bode  

On Wed, Oct 7, 2015 at 1:29 PM, Bode <ominira@gmail.com> wrote:
UGO,
 
It will be a big shame, and really irresponsible, if you cannot come up with any statement from me, direct or indirect, that targets any group in any way. You do not win arguments by throwing up labels. This is becoming characteristic of you. I am still waiting, and if you cannot find one, you should apologize. 

The point I have made before and which I reiterate is that no citizen has transcendental rights. To the extent that there is a huge diversity of norms within the national space, you cannot move from Lagos and expect to exercise the same liberties that you exercised in Lagos in Katsina. Of course, there are things and places that are very similar and where you could exercise the same liberties but to make uniform/unitary claims on the basis of your citizenship everywhere within a diverse national space is to be disruptive and endanger the peace. Only a monarch can make such claim over a territory. This is not xenophobia. It is commonsense.  

I demand you please show me where I made xenophobic statements or apologize. 

Bode 

On Wed, Oct 7, 2015 at 7:41 AM, Bode <ominira@gmail.com> wrote:
Ugo,

If your student makes a grievous charge against you such as xenophobia and you asked him for some example and he says "it is all archived." I am sure you will either dismiss him lazy or you will ask him to get some help. Again, this would be a psychiatric case.  You need to get some help, my friend, if you really think federalism is xenophobia.

The rights of any Nigerian should be circumscribed by specific local contexts, that is the meaning of what you quoted from me above.

Bode

On Wed, Oct 7, 2015 at 12:20 AM, Ugo Nwokeji <ugo@berkeley.edu> wrote:
"No citizen, for example, can embody all the rights of a state, not even the head of state. If he were, that is the head of state, to embody all the rights of a state, he becomes a monarch. Thus, the concept of "full" citizenship is itself an absurdity as it implies an unbounded prerogative that makes every citizen a monarch. "-- Bode

What the hell are you talking about?! 

You are fast developing a tendency to set up a strawman or otherwise to keep convoluting issues when you have no answer to the issue at stake. Which citizenship rights are you talking about that would make "every citizen a monarch"?

Regarding xenophobia, my friend, you made xenophobic arguments. It is all archived.

Ugo 


G. Ugo Nwokeji
Director, Center for African Studies
Associate Professor of African American Studies
University of California, Berkeley
686 Barrows Hall #2572
Berkeley, CA 94720
Tel. (510) 542-8140
Fax (510) 642-0318
Twitter: @UgoNwokeji

On Tue, Oct 6, 2015 at 6:49 AM, Bode <ominira@gmail.com> wrote:
Ugo,

To your point, in a diverse society, it stands to reason that there would be a diversity of rights and constraints that any notion of citizenship cannot simply embody as a totality. No citizen, for example, can embody all the rights of a state, not even the head of state. If he were, that is the head of state, to embody all the rights of a state, he becomes a monarch. Thus, the concept of "full" citizenship is itself an absurdity as it implies an unbounded prerogative that makes every citizen a monarch. 

The current crisis is the crisis of a system that is in a state of confusion about what activities and claims, commercial or otherwise, could be entertained in any given place, and by whom. In a system where state and local rights are properly designated, contestations and negotiations of space are easily navigable. To propose in the first place that designations of rights undermine citizenship is where the error and confusion lie. This is the connection, which I am sure you noticed, and would admit, between this debate and the other one.

By the way, isn't it bizarre and anti-intellectual, whatever your point may be, to inject xenophobia into a discussion of mobility and state structure? Must every thing come down to this? It is better to avoid the perception of persecution in every thing as this is symptomatic of a percussion complex, which, I might add, is a psychiatric condition. When did federalism become a xenophobic position? 


Bode

On Mon, Oct 5, 2015 at 10:59 PM, Bode <ominira@gmail.com> wrote:
Ugo, 

Xenophobic? You forgot to also use the other lexicon in the politics of blackmail, genocidal!! 

Bode 

On Mon, Oct 5, 2015 at 3:06 PM, Ugo Nwokeji <ugo@berkeley.edu> wrote:
Bode,

What has citizenship rights have to do with this or are you deliberately confusing issues in order to mask xenophobic arguments you have made before against certain fellow Nigerians? Listen up, I will be the first person to defend the citizenship rights of Fulani herders because I don't slant my position on rights according to the group that is involved. Rights are rights, and everybody -- Igbo, Hausa, Fulani, Yoruba, Ibibio, etc. -- has a right to enjoy it.

Before this, I have so far made two interventions in this thread. The first was to voice my support for Professor Mbaku's plea not tar every Fulani with the misdeeds of some of their kin. The second followed Obediah Malaifa's and Moses's detailed description of the lived experience of victims of certain Fulani herders, particularly in the middle belt. I made clear in this second contribution that one's citizenship rights (which everyone is entitled to in Nigeria, although you, Bode, would rather grant them to some groups and deny them others), do not include murdering people and taking their lands by force. Do you disagree with this?

I repost the said second of mine post below (and you will see that those defending citizenship rights are alive, well and contributing to this debate:
-------------------------
​
From: Ugo Nwokeji <ugo.nwokeji@gmail.com>
Date: Fri, Sep 25, 2015 at 11:40 AM
Subject: Re: USA Africa Dialogue Series - Fwd: Edo_Global. AFIS-- FULANI HAS SOME POWER ONLY IN NIGERIA AND HAVE ZERO POWER EVERYWHERE SCATTERED POOREST AND DESTITUTES IN 15 COUNTRIES EVERYWHERE ==FULANI ARE BORN TO RULE, IGBO ARE BORN TO CRY.[ Questions on the role of the Fulani in Nigeria]
To: usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com


Thanks,  Moses, for focusing this conversation to the menace of the Fulani herders in parts of Nigeria, particularly the Middle Belt, as opposed to the Fulani as an ethnic group - - an undifferentiated whole.

This menace is a major problem crying for urgent solution. A situation where people are susceptible to orchestrated attacks, massacre and displacement in any part of the country, much less in their natal homes, is unacceptable. Sadly, this phenomenon recalls the tragic era of slave-raiding and plunder.

The fact that this is happening and getting worse in Nigeria is a resounding indictment of the Nigerian state. I can't see this happening unchecked in any other African country and the government appearing helpless, except in countries like the old Sudan (particularly in the context of civil wars) and Mauritania, only because of tacit state support, and Somalia and Libya only because they basically no longer have a government.

We have to ask, What kind of arrangement do we have where the state do little or nothing while citizens are systematically and routinely massacred en masse?

Our penal code prescribes punishments for these kinds of offences, but they are mostly never enforced in these cases. Nobody has the right to encroach on another person's property or massacre people, forcefully displace them and take their property. Our governments have not instructed the security forces to deal with this menace with the seriousness it deserves. Period.

The question we should be asking is, why?

Ugo



G. Ugo Nwokeji
Director, Center for African Studies
Associate Professor of African American Studies
University of California, Berkeley
686 Barrows Hall #2572
Berkeley, CA 94720
Tel. (510) 542-8140
Fax (510) 642-0318
Twitter: @UgoNwokeji

On Sat, Oct 3, 2015 at 9:59 AM, Bode <ominira@gmail.com> wrote:
Why is no one defending the citizenship rights of Fulanis to live and herd their cattle anywhere in Nigeria? Where are the proponents and defenders of full unitary citizenship?

Bode

On Sat, Oct 3, 2015 at 10:18 AM, Oluwatoyin Adepoju <toyinkaidara@gmail.com> wrote:
I post articles that I agree with and those I dont agree with, whether the agreement or disagreement is total or partial.

My views on the Flulani herdsmen crisis is summed up in my earlier summations that Fulani insistence on nomadic grazing, sustaining this anachronistic lifestyle with force of arms, encroaching on others property, killing, raping  and maiming, is a great problem for Nigeria, along with reports of Fulani efforts at colonisation in various parts odf Nigeria, behaviour that is sustained for years likely bcs of the prominent position of Fulanis in Nigerian politics.

Various first hand accounts  and news summations on this group, news reports and research  reports from different parts of the world  justify my views on this.

The Fulani herdsmen menace and the Fulani colonisation agenda is described as killing more people in Nigeria than Boko Haram.

thanks

toyin



On 3 October 2015 at 13:35, Salimonu Kadiri <ogunlakaiye@hotmail.com> wrote:
My sincere apology to you for changing your first name from Oluwatoyin to Olanrewaju. However, you forwarded the post because it corroborates your opinion on Fulani's herdsmen. Be progressive and stop re-posting reactionary and brain clogging articles on this forum.
Fraternally yours,
S. Kadiri
 
Date: Sat, 3 Oct 2015 12:28:23 +0100
Subject: Re: USA Africa Dialogue Series - Breaking..Fulani kidnap Yoruba Oba [Unfolding Crisis in Nigeria]
From: toyinkaidara@gmail.com
To: usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com


The post was

FORWARDED

by Oluwatoyin Adepoju, as part of information on the subject

not written by him.

thanks

toyin

On 2 October 2015 at 17:59, Salimonu Kadiri <ogunlakaiye@hotmail.com> wrote:
This is another brain clogging post from Olanrewaju Adepoju. Accompanying his post is a photograph of a shepherd carrying a gun while watching his cows grazing the grass. There were no visible houses, roads or streets in the picture shown. Yet, Olanrewaju Adepoju could ask : Are Nigerians allowed to carry guns in the streets and roads? His illustrative picture shows a shepherd carrying a gun in the midst of his cows not in a road or street but in a bush site. Premised on the picture of a shepherd carrying a gun in a bush site, Olanrewaju Adepoju then generalised that "These people own Nigeria indeed." One man in Adepoju's world of fables is THESE PEOPLE.
 
Concerning the main story said to have been culled from the Sun newspaper, the following is extracted, "The account said the gunmen, numbering about five and suspected to be Fulani herdsmen might have whisked the traditional ruler on a motorbike to an unknown destination. The Sun was quoting an eyewitness account of the kidnapping of the traditional ruler yet the eyewitness was not sure of how many gunmen were engaged in the kidnapping, through the expression 'the gunmen numbering about five.' The eyewitness was not sure either if the kidnappers were Fulani herdsmen, because he or she only suspected them to be Fulani herdsmen. Why should Fulani herdsmen be suspected? Did they leave their herds of cattle behind after kidnapping the traditional ruler? Do Fulani herdsmen drive their cattle around by riding on motorbike? This is one of the most unintelligent post I have ever come across on this forum and if I am wrong, please correct me.

 
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 2015 15:02:49 +0100
Subject: Re: USA Africa Dialogue Series - Breaking..Fulani kidnap Yoruba Oba [Unfolding Crisis in Nigeria]
From: ayo.m.o.obe@gmail.com
To: usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com


"These people"?

Were you sleeping when OPC marched down Ikorodu Road in Lagos during the general election campaign brandishing their weapons in support of their demands relating to Permanent Voters Cards and Card Readers while the Nigeria Police Force looked on?

Ayo


On Fri, Oct 2, 2015 at 9:40 AM, Oluwatoyin Adepoju <toyinkaidara@gmail.com> wrote:

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: vincent modebelu vin_modebelu@yahoo.com [NIgerianWorldForum] <NIgerianWorldForum@yahoogroups.com>
Date: 1 October 2015 at 16:58
Subject: [NIgerianWorldForum] ||NaijaObserver|| Breaking..Fulani kidnap Yoruba Oba
To: naijaobserver <naijaobserver@yahoogroups.com>, Nigerian World Forum <nigerianworldforum@yahoogroups.com>, TalkNaija <talknigeria@yahoogroups.com>, Talkhard <talkhard@yahogroups.com>


 

Oba Adebisi Oba­demi, the traditional ruler of Apaa-Bunu community in Kabba-Bunu Local Government Area of Kogi State.


 
  
Are Nigerians allowed to carry guns in the streets and roads ?

These people own Nigeria indeed.



vin.....///
....Born to tell the truth
....they are listening indeed
... thick walls will  fall

SHARE 
GUNMEN yesterday ab­ducted Oba Adebisi Oba­demi, the traditional ruler of Apaa-Bunu community in Kabba-Bunu Local Government Area of Kogi State.
An eyewitness told Dai­ly Sun that the traditional ruler was abducted at about 7.30 a.m. yesterday on his way to Odo – Ape, a sub­urb community close to his domain.
The account said the gunmen, numbering about five and suspected to be Fulani herdsmen might have whisked the tradition­al ruler on a motorbike to an unknown destination.
While condemning the dastardly act, a prominent political leader in the area and a Senior Special As­sistant to Governor Idris Wada, Duro Meseko, said the spate of kidnapping in the area was getting alarm­ing and called on law en­forcement agents to be pro active in their activities.
Meseko, who also called on the police authorities to establish a permanent po­lice station in the area also decried the activities of Fulani herdsmen, who he alleged were frequently fo­menting trouble in the area.
The governor's aide also called on President Muhammadu Buhari to quickly address the issue of kidnapping in the country, saying law abiding citizens were now living in fear.
A source close to the Commissioner of Police, Emmanuel Ojukwu, con­firmed the incident but blamed the people in the area for allowing kidnap­ping to thrive in the area.
The source said when the police made attempts in the previous kidnap incidents to launch an attack on the hide out of the kidnappers in the area, the same peo­ple allegedly pleaded that they would rather pay the ransom to the kidnappers than exposing the victims to any form of hurt, add­ing that it makes the police helpless.
The source, however, quoted the CP to have vowed to flush out crimi­nals in the area even as he urged residents to report any suspicious movement in the area, saying the po­lice would not tolerate any incident of break down of law and order.
Meanwhile, as the time of filing this report, no ran­som had been demanded by the abductors.




__._,_.___
Posted by: vincent modebelu <vin_modebelu@yahoo.com>
Reply via web post • Reply to sender • Reply to group • Start a New Topic • Messages in this topic (1)


Philip Achusim pachusim@yahoo.com [NaijaObserver] <NaijaObserver@yahoogroups.com>

17:23 (16 hours ago)
to Okonkwonetworks, igboworldforum, anambra-worldf., nigerianworldf., talknigeria
 

Vin:

That boy was carrying that gun to scare the cattle. If Ezeana wants all those cattle plus the boy, I can send a teenage girl to take that BB gun from him. Then all the cattle and the boy are mine. If they ever want to look for the boy or the cattle, they have to look at latrines all over the world, including Sambisa Forest.

Here is another Igbo adage you can translate to the guys toting guns thinking that they have power. Awor kwere na agwo ga eloya, olo yay. Have you ever run into a snake choking on a prey it could not subdue? If anyone does not want Fulani herders with their cattle on their farms, and they insist, you pull the Chibok girls incident on them. People in southern Nigeria can also pull the Chibok girls phinom. The Fulani cattlemen and their cattle come up missing and no one saw a thing. Instead of looking for them in any Sambisa Forest, you look for them in latrines all over the world. That guy in Port Harcourt who had a nice steak dinner before boarding a plane to London will shit that steak on the plane or in London. If you are looking for the missing cattle, it could be part of the shit in London latrines.




And I am
Ezeana Achusim
Odi-Isaa
Nwa Dim Orioha AKA Onyeukwu.

Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone

.

gukaegbu@comcast.net [NIgerianWorldForum] <NIgerianWorldForum@yahoogroups.com>

18:24 (15 hours ago)
to NIgerianWorldF.
 




Are Nigerians allowed to carry guns in the streets and roads ?


No.  But Northern Nigerians can do whatever they want in Nigeria


Northern Nigerians are Primus Inter Pares among all the peoples of Nigeria


Other Nigerians are fine with it and even promote and propagate the idea of Northern Supremacy because--


Wen the British left, they handed Nigeria to Northern Nigerians for Colonialism 2.0.


If any other Nigerian were to openly carry a Kalashnikov on the street or in the bush


That Nigerian will be cut down where they stands.


That's the reality in Nigeria.


                  *ezekwe*


Eyenisong Ibibio akwaibom2day@yahoo.com [talkhard] <talkhard@yahoogroups.com>

07:05 (2 hours ago)
to C15201947, NIgerianWorldF., Ode-Besilu's, Nmenme
 

If the murderous activities of these retards called Fulani herdsmen are not checked forthwith, then we are again courting disaster that is sure waiting to happen. All State Houses of Assembly should pass a law banning both open grazing and primitive method of transporting cattle in each of the states.

These Fulani herdsmen should be restricted as much as possible. They are the next big thing after Boko Haram. We can't continue to close our eyes to their criminal activities as if they are overlords.

Eyenisong.


__,_._,___


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