PS
In anticipation of what you're going to say, I should like to point out the following, but not in order to pre-empt you:
You keep on harping on the difference between the situation for the Igbos in pre-Biafra Nigeria with the anti-Igbo pogroms in the North etc. and the situation of the Jewish people in Nazi Germany (The Nuremberg Race Laws etc.) and the perennial anti-Semitism in other parts of Europe before WW2.
About the Igbos, you asked, "how could persecuted, oppressed, marginalised and unjustly treated Igbos in Nigeria have been able to acquire properties?"
Dear Salimonu, you could well ask the same question about the Jews of Nazi Germany and the rest of Europe: "how could persecuted, oppressed, marginalised and unjustly treated Jews in Europe have been able to acquire properties?"
One little last thing about abandoned properties. After staying in hotels for three months @ £60 per day (bill footed by the Rivers State Got) Mr. Harry (at the ministry of education Port Harcourt) eventually got me accommodation in Port Harcourt - in the course of scouting for a accommodation some discussion of abandoned properties) - he got me the top floor of an apartment with all modern facilities but (it's called empathy) I gave the apartment to a Ghanaian friend Reuben Atilley – a choreographer and dance teacher because he had a large family and I was only expecting to be joined by Better Half and son. At the end of the day (I already knew too many people in Port Harcourt, chief of whom best friends George, Ernest, Cromwell, Emma Wopara, Bassey) thought that social life in that city was going to be too hectic and that's how I arranged with Lady Ngozi ("take it easy Cornelius") – nice & easy, God bless Nigeria and was content with the little bungalow and work in Ahoada. Btw I much prefer the pastoral African village life (Makeni, Magburaka in the Sierra Leone forests) to the hustle and bustle of city civilisation. But on weekends it was back to city civilisation, Prince David Bull at Romeo Hotel , the Salt& Pepper disco in Port Harcourt, Kofi Sammy in Aba, Dr. Sir Warrior & Oriental Brothers @ the White House in Owerri etc.--- you only live once, and that was a grass bachelor's life, nothing to regret.
N.B. I am not a Lugardist at heart.
Always Yours Sincerely,
Cornelius
Stockholm,
On Sunday, 22 November 2015 20:20:13 UTC+1, ogunlakaiye wrote:
With eloquently crafted Oxford English, you narrated below that you met Alfred Papapreye Diete-Spiff, the former Governor of Rivers State and even Chief Justice of Rivers State but none of them spoke to you about Biafra or abandoned properties. I wonder why a Biafran hugging liberal like you did not seize the opportunity of your association with the aforementioned friends of yours to discuss abandoned properties of the Igbo in Port Harcourt....
In your item 2, you exclaimed, "Yes indeed, the Nazis looted Jewish property," as if I had disputed it. What I have cautioned you not to do is to equate the persecution of the Jews in Europe, up to the end of World War II, with the fate of the Igbo in the Nigerian civil war. Only a Biafran extremist will equate Igbo situation in Nigeria to pre-World War II situation of the Jews in Europe.
In the same item 2 you wrote, "And when it comes to Biafra, IBK would probably be the first to say that 1981-1984, I have been soaked and marinated in Biafra propaganda." The impression I get from reading the foregoing is that you were in Nigeria, Rivers State, between 1981 and 1984. If that is true, it means that your statement in item 1 (Many different people pointed out some of these houses and others of impeccable integrity mentioned the facticity of allegedly abandoned properties) was an Igbo folklore developed from their myths on the civil war. By 1981 when you arrived in Nigeria Igbo had fully been re-integrated into Nigeria after the war that ended on January 15, 1970. The vice President of Nigeria was Dr Alex Ekwueme and the Speaker of the House was Edwin Ume-Ezeoke. Igbo were in all parts of Nigeria in large numbers. Your informants on abandoned properties probably saw you as a semi-arian race and sold the folklore to you with the intention of attracting your sympathy and handouts of money. Your mission in Port Harcourt was not to investigate thirteen years old abandoned Igbo properties and there was no reason for anyone to come and complain to you about his/her abandoned properties unless he/she could get some pecuniary gains from you. It is amusing to read from you that oppressed, persecuted, marginalised and unjustly treated could be allowed by their oppressors and persecutors to acquire properties. Very soon, you will say Palestinians are acquiring properties, not in Sadam's Iraq but, in Netanyahu's Israel.
As if the Igbo must sing the same song as the Scots and Catalans, you asked, "What is the motivation of Scots and Catalans?" If the Scots and Catalans sing, Divided we stand, United we fall to the United Kingdom and Spain respectively, why must Igbo sing the same song to Nigeria? Are you saying everything done by the Caucasians is good and should be copied by Africans? Intoxicated with the wine of every man gotta a right to determine his own destiny, you want every village in Nigeria to be a country because in Sierra Leone, a tree makes a forest!! I disagree with you.
S.Kadiri
Date: Sat, 21 Nov 2015 14:32:19 -0800
From: cornelius...@gmail.com
To: usaafric...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: USA Africa Dialogue Series - Today's QuoteDear Ogbeni Kadiri,
Before any of these most recent forum discussions of Biafra you have told me time without number that you are not against Biafra per se - (We are all Nigerians etc.) and I believe you.
Many different people pointed out some of these houses and others of impeccable integrity mentioned the facticity of allegedly abandoned properties. I don't feel called upon to reveal their names. In my first week in Nigeria, I had dinner with the former Governor of Rivers state Alfred Papapreye Diete-Spiff at his residence, but we did not speak about Biafra and I did not return to visit him because I saw some nice mademoiselles at his residence and as if by precognition did not wanting to get even remotely involved or to get too close to any of them or their ogas, so that later when things go wrong my ass does not becomes grass. . Nor did the Chief Justice of Rivers State who I met the first week and finally two days before I felt Nigeria ever breathe the word Biafra in my ear. In London, Port Harcourt, Owerri, Aba and Umuahia I met and stayed with other Ogas who were much closer to Biafra…
Yes indeed, the Nazis looted Jewish property. Now please stop being pompous and overly self-righteous. Even if you don't know any better, I know that in saying that in no way was it meant to be "an extreme belittlement of the Jewish sufferings in Nazi Europe and over-exaggeration of Igbo sufferings during the civil war in Nigeria to equate the two un-identical events in history as one." By the way in 1969 someone looted a painting worth £15,000 Sterling belonging to me and my Better Half ( I wrote to Professor Simon Ottenberg about this a few years ago )
You know that I don't doubt or have any reason to doubt your absolute honesty, integrity, sincerity, high moral ground or that your points of view are partly informed by your own experience of the Biafra War and that you would not like to see a repeat of either the Biafran death toll, some death by starvation or more Federal military suffering.
To give an extreme example, I could say that your own bitter experience of the Bifara war could be akin to that of Sa'd ibn Mu'adh who had been badly wounded (by his Jewish cousins) at the Battle of Khyber - except that I'm sure that with your Biafran countrymen you would be more magnanimous. And it was this man Sa'd ibn Mu'adh that the Prophet of Islam (s.a.w.) asked – after the Muslim warriors had been victorious, "What shall we do with these Jews? (These Jewish prisoners of war?) and Sa'd, still in pain, recommended the following fate for the defeated Jews of Kyhber, the Banu Qurayza: "Slaughter the males and sell the female into slavery "
I know for a fact that you wouldn't pass such a judgment on a vanquished Biafra people circa 1970…
I too subscribe to not just the notion of tawhid but the principle of unity generally as in 2000 Blacks got to be free
Yes, I do have my own positions about the Second World War, about various Liberation movements in Africa, South America and other parts of the world and very strong positions about Middle East politics too. And when it comes to Biafra, IBK would probably be the first to say that 1981-1984 I have been soaked and marinated in Biafra propaganda. But I was soaked and marinated long before that in fact at the behest of Professor Eldred Durosimi Jones we were among the first people to sign letters of protest when his friend Wole Soyinka was detained by the Federal authorities …
Both of us must admit that the Nigerian scenario is very different today from what it was such as the pogroms of Igbos in Northern Nigeria before the 30th May, 1967, when the secession of Biafra was declared . Now you keep on saying that the pro-Biafra people's main motives are based on (your words) claims "that Igbos are persecuted, oppressed, marginalised and unjustly treated in Nigeria." This should not get too long but I can give you many examples of people who are "persecuted, oppressed, marginalised and unjustly treated "but nevertheless "have been able to acquire properties" e.g. in what was Saddam's Iraq?
Your problem is that you seem to think that if that is the only motive for Biafrans wanting their Biafra that is enough reason for them not to expect that their hard earned properties bank accounts etc. should be illegally seized by the remnant Federal Republic of Nigeria. I come to this conclusion as the answer to your rhetorical question "Are the liberal populists not becoming unreasonable to think that if the Igbos secede because of injustice, they will get justice over acquired properties in Nigeria after secession?"
What is the motivation of the Scots and the Catalans?
And what pray, would be the motivation for the Oduduwa secessionists wanting their own Yoruba Republic or Kingdom apart from wanting to establish a great country or is the song that begins
" Every man gotta right to decide his own destiny,
And in this judgement there is no partiality…"
Only an idle child's nursey rhyme?
I haven't read the Swedish papers for the past two days and must do so now.
By the way my son Ola has written a preface to the Swedish edition of Assata Shakur's autobiography. Time has passed: he started school at Ahoada, in Nigeria.
Talk to you later.
Menahem.
We Sweden
On Saturday, 21 November 2015 20:12:29 UTC+1, ogunlakaiye wrote:Menahem Hamelberg,
I am not anti-Biafra and I do not hate those claiming to be one but I am opposed to the motives being adduced for the demand to excise the Igbo from Nigeria to become Biafra. After the civil war, Igbo people had fully been integrated into Nigeria and they have participated, with other ethnic groups of Nigeria, in the corrupt governments of the country. The only position a person of Igbo ethnic language is yet to hold in Nigeria is the presidency. Therefore, I am against flat-footed populists craving the excise of Igbo from Nigeria on the ground that Igbos are persecuted, oppressed, marginalised and unjustly treated in Nigeria. While the flatfooted populists keep on pressing their venomous snake kisses on the cheeks of the Igbo, they asked of what would be the legal status of properties owned by persecuted, oppressed, marginalised and unjustly treated Igbos in various parts of Nigeria, should Biafra come into being. Question which the liberal populists should answer is, how could persecuted, oppressed, marginalised and unjustly treated Igbos in Nigeria have been able to acquire properties? Are the liberal populists not becoming unreasonable to think that if the Igbos secede because of injustice, they will get justice over acquired properties in Nigeria after secession?
Menahem Hamelberg previously wrote, "It's the first piece of news that I saw first-hand in my first week in Port Harcourt: Igbo owned houses were pointed out to me that had been allegedly abandoned and therefore auctioned away at Five Naira a piece. THE NAZIS COMMITTED SIMILAR CRIMES SUCH AS THE LOOTING OF JEWISH PROPERTY." Here, you have climbed the tree beyond the leaves and consequently have to fall down. Who pointed out Igbo owned houses that had allegedly been abandoned and therefore auctioned at Five Naira a piece? Was your informant an Igbo, Ijaw, or Ogoni? How reliable was your informant? Were you present when the auction took place? You have elongated falsehood to its elastic breaking point!!
The Nigerian civil war was fought to keep the nation one and not to exterminate the Igbo people. The Nigerian situation could not be compared to Nazi Europe. Hence, it is an extreme belittlement of the Jewish sufferings in Nazi Europe and over-exaggeration of Igbo sufferings during the civil war in Nigeria to equate the two un-identical events in history as one. Right from 1925/26, Adolf Hitler had propagated in his Mein Kampf that 'One blood demands one Reich.' His intention to exterminate the Jews was known to other European countries that shared similar ideas about the Jews. Hatred against the Jews in Europe pre-dated Hitler. Nigeria is the only country in the world that has ever fought a war under the supervision of International Observers who testified that the Nigerian forces never perpetrated genocide against the Igbo.
Igbos also had shops, you asserted, and then went on to ask: or did they move their shops, carted them off in wheelbarrows...? War began on July 6, 1967 and by May 1968 Port Harcourt was captured. From May 30, 1967, Gowon had announced land and sea blockade of the then Biafra, an action which made influx of goods and commodities scarce in Port Harcourt. Shops in Port Harcourt by the time it was captured were already empty. You should also understand that shops are parts of buildings which are not moveable, even though articles for sales could be moved. On the assumed abandoned houses which I said the owners could reclaim on presenting valid documents of ownership, Menahem Hamelberg countered me with questions. Hear him, "Suppose the papers had been burned (arson) or had otherwise disappeared? Or the exercise was being conducted in an atmosphere of fear? You think that it's justice that a man has to re-buy his own house/houses at an auction?" A war refugee fleeing from Port Harcourt could not have left documents attributing the ownership of his house(s) behind in as much as he hoped to return after the war. However, it was reported that fleeing Igbo from Port Harcourt deliberately destroyed their houses because they did not hope to return there and they did not want them to fall into the hands of indigenous Port Harcourt's tribe. One cannot lay claim to a house or property without valid documents to attest to ownership. Legal document of ownership is a must requirement, if more than a person are claiming ownership of the same property. As for the hypothetic question of if 'the whole exercise was being conducted in an atmosphere of fear' I think it is unjust to insinuate such a scenario. Why should one be guessing about if there was
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