2 a-m.
Dear Ken,
Loquacious and verbose, let him ramble on.
Where have all the young men gone ?
Sadly, what some people don't realise is that as a result of all this fratricidal killing and maiming in Afghanistan, Iraq, Syria, Yemen, Libya, Nigeria, everywhere, simultaneous with whole societies being destroyed, uprooted, millions internally displaced, millions of refugees, millions of broken families, so many widows, the Muslim fighting force of able-bodied young men is gradually but surely being depleted. That what's happening and when they are war-weary and completely finished, somebody produces a peace treaty which dictates the terms of surrender to the defeated and then says, "Sign here!"
About some of the conditions that produce jihadists, what you say is corroborated by many reports and newspaper articles about the making of a jihadist.
It's a surprise for some that the London Bridge attackers were not some hard-nosed Islamists : London Bridge attackers were regulars at Sunday afternoon pool sessions
When his country is attacked and occupied by foreign forces what is the Jihadist supposed to do? There are many passages in the Quran that give him the legal cover if not the motivation to fight whatever injustices he may perceive, such as imperialism and colonialism.
Lovey-dovey Sufism and sufistic aphorisms such as "Love is the bridge between you and everything" do not translate into put down your weapons of resistance and love your enemies...
Here's some other news that will make some people feel or see blue: Russian Ambassador to Israel: We Do Not Consider Hamas And Hizbullah To Be Terrorists At All...
When David Grossman was here a few years ago he told us that at the height of the Second Intifada, in the Jerusalem neighbourhood in which he lived they had to split their children up and send them to school in different buses; still looming large, the spectre of a young man boarding the bus, wearing an outer garment a couple of sizes too big for him, with sleeves down to his fingertips or with a pack strapped to his back at the sight of which everybody dives out of the bus. As the Quran says , "And thou wilt find them (the Jews) greediest of mankind for life and (greedier) than the idolaters. (Each) one of them would like to be allowed to live a thousand years. And to live (a thousand years) would by no means remove him from the doom. Allah is Seer of what they do."
But I think that even Chidi would be scared if Biafran Security were to make a public announcement there in Owerri that thousands of radicalised Muslims /potential Boko Haram radicals had moved to his town or were already there living legally in Igboland and potentially wishing their fellow citizens no good. In a free Biafra (Bia-free-a) things would be a little different...
SÄPO's new figures that in Sweden right now there are thousands of "radicalised" Muslim extremists living in our midst, not behind bars but roaming free in their thousands is scary. It increases the national paranoia, everybody on the alert : Breaking news: thousands of radicalised Muslims/ Muslim extremists in our midst. Where? Everywhere !
And here Apostle Johnson preaching violence and destruction in the name of Jesus...
It's bad enough when Cornelius who has nothing against Islam sees anyone sporting a Talibanic beard and thinking "Ah! One of them !"or "potentially one of them" and you can never be sure! I have a friend from Algeria, who lost an arm fighting with the Mujahideen against the Soviets in Afghanistan (He is now more of a theologian than an Islamic warrior - the second to last time I met him he said that he could assure me that on no occasion did the Almighty ever speak to Aaron.)
Several Muslim men and women have travelled to Syria and Iraq to join forces with various Jihadists there. Some have returned and having acquired some military experience it is feared that they could turn on those perceived to be their local enemies...
You say, "but if it came to more repression of the muslim community as a strategy to end it, I am sure that will backfire." By "backfire," I suppose you mean " explode"? Implode - with lots of fire? Sooner or later repression leads to explosion. In as far as anti-Muslim immigration is the islamophobic wind of change blowing over Europe, each and every terrorists attack in Europe just makes things worse. When I first heard about the Tower in London burning down to the ground, my first thought was arson on a tower where mostly foreigners and a large number of Muslims lived...
After SÄPO's announcement a great many Muslim youngsters could now be under suspicion - if not by the Security Police, then under suspicion by their neighbours - everywhere - in the streets in the department stores, in the tube, boarding the bus right now, at the airport. There was the case of a woman who was seated next to a bearded young man resulting in her refusing to travel on that plane...
I sent this titillating quote to a friend from France :"Mieux vaut être avec une vieille femme qui vous conduira au succès que de sortir avec une jeune fille qui a toujours faim (SOPEKA) et qui vous mènera (conduira) à la ruine "( President Macron) and got this in reply : "I don't like Macron and don't intend to vote for him on Sunday. The first thing he did was to support an anti-Israeli Arab-supported vote at Unesco ("Israel has no cultural ties to Jerusalem"LOL!!!) If he prefers old women that's his problem! I don't care a fig!"
My own response to that is :" If it's true that he said such a thing, then Macron is no better than a couchon"
Still no relief for my piles... writing this kind of crap about how mortal we all are makes me painfully aware that our days are numbered and that I personally could be "the greediest of mankind for life" with no prophetic dreams yet about the 72 dark eyed virgins waiting for me or Macron to look forward on the other side, am in no hurry for the carnival to be over and to meet my Creator.
Praying that tomorrow is another day.
Cornelius
On Saturday, 17 June 2017 15:05:04 UTC+2, Kenneth Harrow wrote:
Hi corneliusYour first question is a hard one, how to put an end fo the violence. You can say, motivated by a sense of religious righteousness, but I don't believe that is really what drives this violence. Young men, raised under conditions in which they feel they are oppressed, are driven by the opportunities afforded them through the wars going on in the middle east. Some are motivated by a newfound faith; others by the belief they are treated badly by the mainstream culture. I am thinking more about france, and probably the u.k., and no doubt the netherlands and esp belgium. The other european countries I know less about, and you can tell us more about scandanavia.They go off to fight in syria, or are convinced to carry the fight on here.This is no longer the result of a fatwa, but the extension of a war that is actually being waged now, with isis being cornered in iraq and syria, and utilizing all their force of fighting back.Imagine a 20 yr old, not particularly happy about how the french or dutch or brits regard or treat them, finding a cause they are now willing to fight in.Another thing is that a large number of those who committed the atrocities in france and britain were also either deranged or ex-criminals. They are the marginal elements, not concerned about killings or death. This all will end, but if it came to more repression of the muslim community as a strategy to end it, I am sure that will backfire.My thoughts on itKenKenneth Harrow
Dept of English and Film Studies
Michigan State University
619 Red Cedar Rd
East Lansing, MI 48824
517-803-8839
From: usaafricadialogue <usaafric...@googlegroups.com > on behalf of Cornelius Hamelberg <cornelius...@gmail.com>
Reply-To: usaafricadialogue <usaafric...@googlegroups.com >
Date: Friday, 16 June 2017 at 18:51
To: usaafricadialogue <usaafric...@googlegroups.com >
Subject: Re: USA Africa Dialogue Series - Re: Achuzia and Realuzation of Biafra--Corrected.
Professor Harrow,
In the name of love and reverence for life, how do you put an end to the violence that's motivated by a sense of religious righteousness?
SÄPO (The Swedish Security Service) has just woken up to the reality; they can now smell the coffee and the gunpowder too as they upgrade the number of radicalised Muslims in Sweden from a mere 200, to "thousands" - although - so they say - only a tiny number of the thousands have the operational ability to make bloody hell in our country. But radical being such a broad term, it probably includes those who would resist oppression of any kind " by any means necessary"
Just for the record:
As you have rightly said, without any room fort miss-understanding, you are not The Lord. Sure, Hallaj was misunderstood. He would have got away with it if his executioners had thought that he was mad. Wasn't Jesus also crucified for saying "ana anal haq"? / "I am the truth"? In Jesus' case he is being reported to have said, "I am the way, the truth and the life ; No one comes to the father except through me." That must have sounded like a challenge to the other Rabbis, Pharisees, making them see red > the blood of Jesus - a Rush-die type fatwa on his head because of what he said.
Of course nowadays, with or without your students or disciples, should you arrive in Jerusalem around the time of the Passover / Easter and make such a claim even at the Mea Shearim, nobody would take you seriously or threaten you with crucifixion. On the other hand if you were to assert that kind of identity in Saudi Arabia any time of the year, that could cause some trouble for you (at which time some leverage from Trump could be your only hope. In such circumstances, I think that preaching Rabbi Jonathan Sacks' Not in God's Name would just make matters worse for you or whoever.
There are two hadiths in this link which illustrate how some of the true Believers (Mumin) believed in those days. The women in question preferred to submit to the punishment ordained by the Sharia in this life - in order to avoid the everlasting fire in the life after death, the olam ha ba
You say that I can chose which side I am on.
1987 : My first Sufi teacher Dr. Javad Nurbakhsh said that after the Prophet of Islam sallallahu alaihi wa salaam blessed the Hereafter the Muslim community that he left behind was divided into
(1) The Arab Nationalists who became the Sunnis
(2) Those who chose to follow Ali ibn Abi Talib (a.s/ r.a) i.e. the Shia
(Incidentally, Imam Ali ( a.s.) was martyred on exactly this day the 21st of Ramadan - having been attacked with a poisoned sword in the mosque at Kufa on the 19th of Ramadan 40 A.H
( 3) The Sufi who transmitted (and still transmit) the esoteric teachings
to which group belonged your Mansur al Hallaj and this book by him : Tawasin
I have heard two of Dr. Nurbaksh's close disciples, one by the name of Terry Graham and the other by the name of Leonard Lewisohn refer to (1) and ( 2) as "the legalists "
1989: My second Sufi teacher Hazrat Sultan Husayn Tabandeh Reza Ali Shah was also a trained Mujtahid and his father's compendium Pand-i Salih ( Salih's Advice) outlines the general rules of that order...
1991 the Rifai order and one more order of the Shadhiliyya branch...
The problem for the Mumin is that he may rightly or wrongly understand that he is obeying orders from Allah the One and Only ALMIGHTY.
I had some difficulty coming to terms with the mass execution of Jews in Medina - I asked some alims/ scholars about it and was given the ultimate Quranic injunction as an answer: Quran 5: 33
Both the Bible and the Quran have their say on homosexuality for example - and you may call them fundamentalists if you want , the zealots who would like to wipe out / " purify" Tel Aviv which is currently "the Mecca of the Gay" in the Holy Land of Israel. The fundamentalists of the 21st century are keen to implement the death penalty, according to their own understanding of what they believe to be a Divine punishment.
The alims say that the Almighty's word cannot be abrogated.
As Chief Bolaji usually says,
And there you have it.
Cornelius
On Thursday, 15 June 2017 14:32:28 UTC+2, Kenneth Harrow wrote:A sufi mystic al-hallaj of the 11th century said, I am the lord (in our prayers on shabbat we say, quoting god, ani adonai elochechem.The war between the sufi and the cleric, the mystic and the uploader of the law, the beautiful spirit and the stern legalist, has existed in islam for a thousand years.You can chose which side you areon.The sufi was killed because of his words, which were never properly understood.rushie's blasphemous words were pronounced by a troubled character and they expressed his crisis of faith. When the words came to the point of pointedly insulting not allah or muhammed, but rather ayatollah komeini, it is said, he put the book down and pronounced the fatwa.
The nazis burnt the books they didn't like and tried to exterminate the people they didn't like
To condemn someone because of his attacks on one's beliefs or identity or anything, as if the words carried harm like acts is not to distinguish words and acts. If the words promote acts, like encouraging people to commit a crime, the responsibility for the words falls on the speaker, who incurs punishment, in most countries, though not the u.s.
If the crime, however, is blasphemy then the community that is offended should use words back, not deeds to punish the speaker.
I base this not on first amendment rights, but my sense of basic human decency—not on the sense that I am the lord.
but then I am not a figure in power, not given the chance to prove how awful a ruler I am. Instead, I dream of al-hallaj who submerged himself in the divine like a wave in the ocean, about which he could only say the words that resulted in his death.
In fact, jesus was not any different; if I worked on it, I could easily put moses or muhammed in the same position.
Gotta go and get ready for tomorrow
ken
Kenneth Harrow
Dept of English and Film Studies
Michigan State University
619 Red Cedar Rd
East Lansing, MI 48824
517-803-8839
From: usaafricadialogue <usaafric...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of Cornelius Hamelberg <cornelius...@gmail.com>
Reply-To: usaafricadialogue <usaafric...@googlegroups.com>
Date: Wednesday, 14 June 2017 at 20:29
To: usaafricadialogue <usaafric...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: USA Africa Dialogue Series - Re: Achuzia and Realuzation of BiafraMuhammad's dead poets society
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