Tuesday, October 25, 2011

USA Africa Dialogue Series - I told You What I do with Mails: Hear from the Republicans on Libya

Hello Africans:
 
It depends, but most often I send my yahoo mails to other places. So here is not my primary audience. I choose, at leisure, to reveal responses. I am a member of group with diehard Republican heavies Inside the Beltway and elsewhere. Sarah Palin joined the group. My business is Africa. I don't care  who is in the group. I am also in democratic groups, black groups, too. As politics goes, I am pragmatic with bi-partisan options: No permanent friends; just permanent interest - Africa. A few minutes ago, I forwarded a response and question with Tope's mail to the Republicans. See the response below.
 
Hehehehe,  Hakim Belhadj and the admitted Al Queda-linked Libyan Islamic Fighting Group (Qatar sponsored)  are the winners. In their first act, they approved polygamy and abolished bank interest rates  based on Sharia in Libya. Influenced by Egypt, they will link up with Iran. This is a classic tribble, Maradona-like. Boy o Boy, don't you love politics?  Belhadj's wife is suing Britain for capturing her husband in the days of Blair-Gaddafi Alliance. The plot cannot get finer within two days. No matter how wild, sodomy is not a thing for liberators.
 
Obama will be hammered on Libya by the Republicans. I need to know which congressional black caucus  member will make pim. I envision an ad:  Obama kills Africans in Africa while African American unemployment rate goes up in America. Obama, a danger to blacks. 
 
MsJoe
 
In a message dated 10/25/2011 4:20:12 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, ninaomay writes:
We are appalled at what he has done both in Egypt and libya.. What nation is next for his distruction. Both of these will now be under sharia law.  This is bad for millions of people.

Sent from my iPad

On Oct 25, 2011, at 3:25 PM, MsJoe21St@aol.com wrote:

 
Hello Tope:
 
Your write-ups are read beyond these forums. You are prolific and up to the task as a public intellectual.  Your views have steered some officials to have 20/20 hindsight. Most of all, this generation is learning.  Running up to NATO's invasion in March, one of the laments was the bewildering absence of African perspectives from the civil society to inform those who are in position to lift a finger. In contrast, the beehive of activities attendant in a Jewish question turns congressional corridors into something else. AIPAC even lobbied Obama against taking a harsh stand in Egypt - because it was to Israel's interest to keep Mubarak in power. The White House was caught off guard when the people power prevailed.
 
Poor Africa, who stands up for her in the thick of realpolik? Tope, that's why you are energizing. A young six grader asked, why are they not bombing Bahrain (which he saw in the  news) and they are bombing Libya? It is difficult not to be overwhelmed while trying to explain to members of the next generation how hypocrisy works, including the double standards of human rights groups.
 
<Nina_May.jpg>Hello Nina (blind copied), http://rwnetwork.net/Nina_May what do you think about this whole invasion? Maybe this is a good analysis for Heritage Foundation to chew on. I know the Republicans like it, making the bombing and destruction of Libyan infrastructure the only mutual bed they willingly hopped on with Obama. I will be returning to active writing in Renaissance Women. This Obama, to demonstrate that he is no Muslim, has gone berserk to prove it.
 
Tope, keep it up.
 
MsJoe
 
In a message dated 10/25/2011 9:39:17 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, topsyfash@yahoo.com writes:
Oga Pat

Thanks for yours. By now my views should be well-known to you.  I am not belligerent in accusing the west of misdeeds.  I also hope I have affected your views too, to the extent that you know that not all what the west does is good.  I am an economist and a damned good one at that.  I have studied statistics and econometrics at a fairly high level.  I know all about causes and effects, and I know the impact that a little dislocation can have on a peoples even in the long run.  That is my grouse with the west.  In that while they are pursuing their own interests, they have left africa in a serious lurch, and because there are not many of us who speak up, our fate in africa is worse that worst!  

HDI has nothing at all to do with population.  I can see you know little about it with your comments below.  It has everything to do with how people live averagely.  If Libya acheived the 55th position in the world, with the resources it has on hand, that is surely remarkable, and if I were Libya's lawyer, that will be my key point in sending the west and its leaders to the chair for what they have done to Libya!  The country was better than Sausi, which has the largest oil reserve in the world, with an equally small population!  It was better than Russia, which has more oil, better than Brazil, which has more oil.  

Mr Pat, I respect you a lot.  Please acknowledge for once that you have been wrong in this instance, and also let these new info I am giving, shape the context of the book you are writing.  I think we shall seriously regret allowing the best country to live in Africa, be totally destroyed by foreigners.  See the index below;


Further, please note that Nigeria has just killed itself by allowing Gaddafi to be killed.  Two clear economic and social implications are immediate.  The west - esp europe - used the war and his killing to seal the route where black people find their ways into europe.  The NTC rebels - rebels they shall remain - are out and out racists.  No self-loving black man will dare cross to europe from libya ever again!  the presence of the western soldiers and intelligence, will finally seal their fate.  Result - our most desperate boys will remain here, crime will spiral out of control.  Then the west has been paying crazy prices for crude.  Nigeria has been spending like no man's business.  At currently close to record prices ($118 to the barrel), Nigeria is yet unable to defend its currency, or even maintain its level of reserves.  With western control of crude in libya and the speed with which they have moved into position - recall UK defence minsiter asking UK businessmen to pack their suitcases and head out immediately - the 1.8million shut in by the war will be released shortly.  In fact this time, it will be had for free by those who 'LIBERATED' Libya.  Result - a crash in crude oil prices to about $50 per barrel.  And Nigeria will be screwed!

I leave you with this list of top producers of crude and top deposits around the world.  Hopefully you will know Libya really tried, in the face of serious opposition from the west - for Gaddafi had a model that would have shown up the fraud that western capitalism was.  And therefore he had to go;

LIST OF COUNTRIES BY OIL RESERVES

§Saudi Arabia   264.6 billion barrels -19 % of world
§Canada   175.2 billion - 12.58% of world
§Iran  137.6 billion - 9.88 % of world
§Iraq   115 billion – 8.26 % of world
§Kuwait   104 billion -7.47 % of world
§UAE   97.8 billion – 7.02 % of world
§Venezuela   97.7 billion – 7.02 % of world
§Russian   74.7 billion – 5.33 % of world
§Libya   47billion – 3.38 % of world
§Nigeria  37.5 billion – 2.69 % of world

LIST OF COUNTRIES BY OIL PRODUCTION
§Russia  10.2million bpd
§Saudi Arabia  9.76million bpd
§USA  9.056 million bpd
§Iran  4.172million bpd
§China  3.991million bpd
§Canada  3.289million bpd
§UAE  2.798million bpd
§Mexico  2.602million bpd
<!--[if ppt]-->§<!--[endif]-->
§Kuwait  2.494million bpd
§Iraq  2.420 million bpd
§European Union   2.383 million bpd
§Norway  2.350 million bpd
§Nigeria  2.300 million bpd
Norway
2,466
Brazil
2,401
United Kingdom
1,584
Kazakhstan
1,429
Indonesia
1,051
<!--[if ppt]-->§<!--[endif]-->


From: "ugepat@yahoo.com" <ugepat@yahoo.com>
To: NIgerianWorldForum@yahoogroups.com; "chumaanierobi@yahoo.com" <chumaanierobi@yahoo.com>; MsJoe <MsJoe21St@aol.com>; naijapolitics <NaijaPolitics@yahoogroups.com>; "NaijaObserver@yahoogroups.com" <NaijaObserver@yahoogroups.com>; "naijaintellects@googlegroups.com" <naijaintellects@googlegroups.com>; "nigeria360@yahoogroups.com" <nigeria360@yahoogroups.com>; "NigerianID@yahoogroups.com" <NigerianID@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2011 10:04 AM
Subject: Re: [NIgerianWorldForum] to DOMINIC..re GOD PUNISH THEM!] British firms urged to 'pack suitcases' in rush for Libya business/ Libya Free!

 
Tope, thank God you acknowledge that the HDI administered by UNDP is the best measure of development and not a device by the West to deceive or under-develop Africa!
Jokes apart, Libya's attaining the 55th place against Nigeria's 145th in HDI is great but may not be as phenomenal as you make it look. I don't want to believe that you deliberately use the figures to try to fool us because you ought to have told us as well that Libya's population is about 6m with an oil export of 1.6mbpd as against Nigeria's 2.1mbpd for 150m people.
Further, the issue is not whether Gaddafi developed Libya or not. He did, but the issue is should he have tried to cling to power by all means when a reasonable proportion of his people thought he needed to go IN SPITE OF those accomplishments you think are so phenomenal that the West had no business coming to rescue Libyans from the iron fist of a despot they were fed up with?
Before we cry more than the bereaved, the Arab League who are stoutly anti-West couldn't have been so stupid that they didn't know what was coming before they endorsed the UN-backed NATO action. Certainly you do not hate the West more than the average Arab.
Let us be circumspect in our analyses.
Patrick Ugeh
Sent from my BlackBerry wireless device from MTN
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 2011 09:01:02 +0000
Subject: Re: [NIgerianWorldForum] to DOMINIC..re GOD PUNISH THEM!] British firms urged to 'pack suitcases' in rush for Libya business/ Libya Free!

Tope, thank God you acknowledge that the HDI administered by UNDP is the best measure of development and not a device by the West to deceive or under-develop Africa!
Jokes apart, Libya's attaining the 55th place against Nigeria's 145th in HDI is great but may not be as phenomenal as you make it look. I don't want to believe that you deliberately use the figures to try to fool us because you ought to have told us as well that Libya's population is about 6m with an oil export of 1.6mbpd as against Nigeria's 2.1mbpd for 150m people.
Further, the issue is not whether Gaddafi developed Libya or not. He did, but the issue is should he have tried to cling to power by all means when a reasonable proportion of his people thought he needed to go IN SPITE OF those accomplishments you think are so phenomenal that the West had no business coming to rescue Libyans from the iron fist of a despot they were fed up with?
Before we cry more than the bereaved, the Arab League who are stoutly anti-West couldn't have been so stupid that they didn't know what was coming before they endorsed the UN-backed NATO action. Certainly you do not hate the West more than the average Arab.
Let us be circumspect in our analyses.
Sent from my BlackBerry wireless device from MTN
From: tope fasua <topsyfash@yahoo.com>
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 2011 21:26:38 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [NIgerianWorldForum] to DOMINIC..re GOD PUNISH THEM!] British firms urged to 'pack suitcases' in rush for Libya business/ Libya Free!

 
Argue with the figures brother...  

The ranking of Libya as the 55th best country in the world, by no less than the UNDP, based on Human Devt Index, which is as yet the best measure of DEVELOPMENT (i should know because I am an economist)...  Is that ranking based on what they saw in Gaddafi's sitting room only?  Or what they saw on the streets in the whole now-besmirched country?  Bros, argue with the figures.  In that same ranking, Nigeria was 145th.  Click the link below and kindly revert.

People have been arguing with me about Freedom this Freedom that.  That the Libyan people were not FREE.  Who defines freedom?  Remember what Fela said about Human Rights and Freedom in BEASTS OF NO NATION!  Oyibo man cannot dash us Freedom or Human Right!  We were born with it!  Because we are human beings.  They cannot define for us what freedom should look like in Africa.  The ability to talk thrash, dress naked, and engage in homosexuality IS NOT FREEDOM!.  The West has simply set Africa on the path of destruction - socially, psychologically and of course economically!

Imagine this; If we had a leader in Nigeria who comes and says 'I WILL GIVE NIGERIANS FREE EDUCATION, A RIGHT TO AN ABODE TO LIVE IN, SECURITY ON THE STREETS, FREE HEALTH CARE AT ANY LEVEL, FOOD FOR THOSE WHO ARE HUNGRY, LOANS FOR THOSE WHO WANT TO START BUSINESS AT NEXT TO NOTHING, AND I WILL ENSURE THAT BY THE HUMAN DEVELOPMENT INDEX, LIFE IN NIGERIA WILL BE FAR FAR IMPROVED, FROM 145TH TO SAY 55TH ON THE RANKING!'.  Will that not be a laudable achievement?  If he wants to achieve that he has to be assertive - a tiger and a General - as against what we have presently that is going to nowhere.  What have we been fighting for since in this country?  Is it not the right to better living?  When you live in Nigeria, you will know that we go to sleep with palpable fear.  And we are FREE!  Free for what?  I say Freedom is not for us to demand.  I say if we do the right thing and are visionary for our country as individuals, we do not have to antagonise govt and go and invite foreigners to come and kill our leaders.  I say if we do the right thing, we do not have to demand for FREEDOM, we would rather be arbiters of freedom, custodians of it.  And by the way we live our lives, we would give freedom to others, and to the world!

Americans certainly have NO FREEDOM to give to anyone.  We have been defrauded.  George Orwell said 'A PEOPLE ARE ABLE TO SLEEP PEACEABLY AT NIGHT BECAUSE THERE ARE ROUGH MEN, STANDING GUARD AT NIGHT, READY TO DO VIOLENCE ON THEIR BEHALF'.  The many rough men of the West, have taken down the only remarkable Rough Man of Africa.  Now look at the horizon, and what we have left are kowtowing, unremarkable, forgetable, underwhelming leaders.  WE ARE FINISHED!

tope



From: Dominic Ogbonna <enyimocha@gmail.com>
To: NIgerianWorldForum@yahoogroups.com; chumaanierobi@yahoo.com; MsJoe <MsJoe21St@aol.com>; naijapolitics <NaijaPolitics@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, October 24, 2011 8:59 PM
Subject: Re: [NIgerianWorldForum] GOD PUNISH THEM!] British firms urged to 'pack suitcases' in rush for Libya business/ Libya Free!

 
Nonsense! A strong leader leaves a LASTING LEGACY. If there is no legacy, there was no leadership!

If Ghadaffi was such a huge success,  how come his country is still in  such a weak and  easily manipulable situation so soon after his death? It hasn't even been one week since Ghadaffi died. Did he not build any lasting institutions in 42 years?  Did he not train  the next generation of leaders and successors?  Was Libya  just one  man's megalomanic show? After 42 years in power, did he leave behind a country easily over-run by foreigners???

Then where is the greatness?  Where is the leadership? Isn't the taste of the pudding in the eating ?


Dominic



On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 3:48 PM, tope fasua <topsyfash@yahoo.com> wrote:
 
GOD - WHEREVER HE IS, IF HE EXISTS - PUNISH THESE BASTARDS!!! AND ALL THOSE WHO SUPPORT THEM! ESPECIALLY THE AFRICANS AMONG THEM!!

From: chuma anierobi <chumaanierobi@yahoo.com>
To: "NIgerianWorldForum@yahoogroups.com" <NIgerianWorldForum@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, October 24, 2011 3:09 PM
Subject: Re: [NIgerianWorldForum] British firms urged to 'pack suitcases' in rush for Libya business/ Libya Free!

 
MSJOE,
 
FRANKLY SPEAKING MY ONLY PART NOW IS TO CRY AS MUCH AS I CAN.
 
Chuma Anierobi
From: "MsJoe21St@aol.com" <MsJoe21St@aol.com>
To: USAAfricaDialogue@googlegroups.com; Camnetwork@yahoogroups.com; nigeria360@yahoogroups.com
Cc: nigerianworldforum@yahoogroups.com; unionews@yahoogroups.com; Africans_Without_Borders@yahoogroups.com; Mwananchi@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, October 24, 2011 7:48 AM
Subject: [NIgerianWorldForum] British firms urged to 'pack suitcases' in rush for Libya business/ Libya Free!

 
Hello Africans.
 
Libya is liberated!!!! NATO bombed the place to stone age recognizance and will use Libya's frozen assets to pay its contractors to rebuild. What says the African clueless? What's your share of the liberation that accompanies your worked up psychic? Mental slaves in economic bondage, you have no operational definition of liberation.  As long as this free Libya  thinks she is free without disturbing Western access to the oil and gold, marry four wives (the new law unveiled); piss in kettles (metaphor); keep the desert undeveloped (no vision otherwise); borrow from IMF/World Bank (like the rest of Africa);  and dare not think and act on African whatever solidarity (a sore reminder);  that's fine. The day any new ruler messes with unfettered West access, they would be gone.
 
Libya is free. Wag your tails. Even if you don't have French wine to uncork, pop palm wine.
 
Cheers,
MsJoe
 
 
British firms urged to 'pack suitcases' in rush for Libya business
New defence secretary says companies should be ready to cash in on reconstruction contracts in newly liberated Libya
guardian.co.uk, Friday 21 October 2011 18.37 EDT
British firms urged to pack suitcases in rush for Libya business
A duck swims near a destroyed building in the Libyan town of Sirte. Photograph: Esam Omran Al-Fetori/Reuters
The starting pistol for British firms to pursue contracts in Libya has been fired by the new defence secretary, Philip Hammond, who urged companies to "pack their suitcases" and head there to secure reconstruction contracts.
As Nato announced that it plans to wind up operations in Libya, Hammond said that great care had been taken during the campaign to avoid destroying critical infrastructure.
"Libya is a relatively wealthy country with oil reserves, and I expect there will be opportunities for British and other companies to get involved in the reconstruction of Libya," he told the BBC in an interview.
"I would expect British companies, even British sales directors, [to be] packing their suitcases and looking to get out to Libya and take part in the reconstruction of that country as soon as they can," said Hammond, who replaced Liam Fox as defence secretary a week ago.
He added that after a "hugely successful" British mission in Libya, Britain now needed "to support the Libyans to turn the liberation of their country into a successful stabilisation so that Libya can be a beacon of prosperity and democracy in north Africa going forward."
The National Transitional Council has already said that it intends to reward countries who showed support for its fight against the Gaddafi regime, with Britain and France likely to lead the way.
The success of British contractors in the country – which could see billions of pounds spent on reconstruction over the next decade – will be seen as a huge victory for prime minister David Cameron, who visited Tripoli and NTC members last month, along with Nicolas Sarkozy.
British gains in Libya include business and reconstruction contracts, as well as oil. As Libya's £100bn in frozen assets around the world are released, it is a sizeable pot.
Lord Green, a trade minister, has already met with British firms to discuss potential opportunities in Libya, and oil company BP is believed to have already held talks with the NTC.
In a press conference in September, Mustafa Abdul Jalil, the interim Libyan prime minister, praised the "brave positions" of Cameron and Sarkozy. "They showed us political, economic and military support, which helped the rebels establish a state, and we thank France and the UK for that," he said.
But while Guma al-Gamaty, the NTC's UK representative, has said Libya would honour contracts signed under the Gaddafi regime, he has also indicated that British companies might not get "easy business" from Libya.
"There will be huge changes in everything – in the oil and gas sectors, in education, and with the creation of new industrial sectors," he said. "But it's not a guaranteed market. Contracts will be awarded not on the basis of political favouritism, but on merit, quality and competitiveness."
France has already begun its own campaign to secure business in the country. French foreign minister Alain Juppé has said it was only "fair and logical" for its companies to benefit.
Daniel Kawczynski, a Conservative backbencher and chair of the cross-party parliamentary group on Libya, said Britain should come first when it comes to awarding contracts, which would also pay back some of the cost of some £300m spent on military action.
"The question that remains is, who should ultimately bear this cost?" he said. "Should the burden fall on those who could be counted on? Or should, in time, Libya repay those who fought with her, and for her?"
He added: "In these difficult economic times, it should not be too much to ask a country with Libya's wealth and resources to pay their share of the gold."









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